1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice

Star Wars Tech

Discussion in 'General Movie Discussion' started by Darth Lexor Kai, Dec 31, 2014.

  1. Darth Lexor Kai

    Darth Lexor Kai General of the Future Folk

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2014
    Posts:
    2,340
    Likes Received:
    4,441
    Trophy Points:
    13,852
    Credits:
    9,075
    Ratings:
    +6,077 / 33 / -8
    Is anyone else frustrated by the lack of technological advances between KOTOR and A New Hope? KOTOR is one of the greatest games of all time. RPG fans who don't follow the star wars craze, like most of us on this site do, will tell you the same thing. My gripe is that the technology in KOTOR is nearly the same as what the rebels have to fight with 4 millennia latter! what gives y'all? they wanted the introduction to this new expanded universe to feel familiar. i get it. even the Ebon Hawk shared similarities to the Falcon. and that's just one example! what makes this really interesting is that when you are out exploring the "ancient Ruins" there is a clear and pronounced divide between the two time periods. Droids haven't really evolved all that much either. if there is an explanation for this id like to read it.

    i think it would have been a bit better if they said it took place 100 years and not 4k. it would have made more since. some civilizations choose to live a more simple life. Ewoks might not have been contacted yet as far as i know that isn't established. But Wookies were part of a slave trade. they understood the tech at hand and knew how to use it to there advantage. They chose not to. latter in the clone wars they still live pretty much the same way. and this isn't just about preservation of heritage. the cultural differences are very clear. aside from the Jedi. maybe we just aren't meant to compare the two.
     
    #1 Darth Lexor Kai, Dec 31, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2014
    • Great Post Great Post x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  2. DarthDwight

    DarthDwight Force Sensitive

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2014
    Posts:
    2,063
    Likes Received:
    2,138
    Trophy Points:
    12,177
    Credits:
    1,565
    Ratings:
    +3,910 / 34 / -23
    Great idea for debate, but I [MOVED] your topic to the General Movie Discussion since it's not necessarily about video games.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  3. Rebo

    Rebo Nearsighted Whill Guardian
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Posts:
    2,500
    Likes Received:
    4,603
    Trophy Points:
    14,747
    Credits:
    6,145
    Ratings:
    +7,330 / 99 / -40
    I’ve always rationalized it by taking it to be a judgment on republic society. This is a civilization that reached its peak and then got lazy and arrogant, personified in the jedi and senate of the PT. It’s a bit of a caricature of real civilization obviously. Over thousands of years, something would change significantly. But from an artistic standpoint, I thought it was done to make that point. The republic stopped advancing and stopped growing. They were a stale society and that is why there was so little change, and why they were susceptible to the corruption of the empire.
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Wise Wise x 2
  4. Darth Lexor Kai

    Darth Lexor Kai General of the Future Folk

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2014
    Posts:
    2,340
    Likes Received:
    4,441
    Trophy Points:
    13,852
    Credits:
    9,075
    Ratings:
    +6,077 / 33 / -8
    thats a great explination but how does that happen to the republic as a whole? were talking billions of people right? maybe trillions. does any one really know? anyways you would think that someone would step up. even if its just an individual tinkerer. i know im comparing apples to oranges but Data from star trek was made in a hut by a genius. Anikan was off building droids before he was 10. they were still very tech savy.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Wise Wise x 1
  5. ZebroGodilla

    ZebroGodilla Darklighter Ace

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Posts:
    865
    Likes Received:
    2,900
    Trophy Points:
    10,802
    Credits:
    5,585
    Ratings:
    +3,385 / 15 / -3
    I like to say it's because of the massive galaxy wide chaos and war. Not Kotor to Episode 1 specifically, but take Episode 2 to Episode 3 to Episode 4. The technology of the galaxy, even in the Outer Rim, is fairly advanced, touch-based, classy, and smooth. But by the opening battle of Episode 3, we see more of how the galaxy has changed, with less emphasis on design and style and more on reliability and better effectiveness, hence the switch from touch to physical buttons in most spaceships, cities, etc. That, and when the Empire comes along, the style itself of the previous era is abandoned to move in its own direction, as noted in the Tarkin novel, one of simplicity but sharpness. And in order to effectively make all of the Empire this way, and not allow planets to keep their cultural identity, poorer places are first to be forcibly changed, such as Lothal, Tatooine, etc. That, and The Clone Wars ravaged the entire galaxy, so just like in real-world history, power that emerges afterwards is more dull, backwards, not-as-sophisticated, etc.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Wise Wise x 1
  6. Rebo

    Rebo Nearsighted Whill Guardian
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Posts:
    2,500
    Likes Received:
    4,603
    Trophy Points:
    14,747
    Credits:
    6,145
    Ratings:
    +7,330 / 99 / -40
    Right. It’s not realistic at all. But I’m not sure it needs to be. You can sometimes have artistic honesty and realism together, but sometimes you make the choice of which is more important. Since you bring up Star Trek. Look at Klingons. Is it realistic to think that a society so enamored with war, destruction and infighting could achieve the technological progress to achieve space flight? It’s possible. But more likely they would never escape the stone age, let alone create an intergalactic empire.

    But they are not meant to be a nuanced look at a potential alien civilization. They are an allegorical construct. Something designed to personify and idea. And that is how I see the old republic. They are the idea of a lazy empire not an actual representation of one. One more dependent on their own comfort and stability than on progress. A caricature of our own society meant to express a warning of what happens when an empire grows stale. So I don’t look for realism as much as thematic consistency. But I understand that others may not see it that way.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  7. Darth Lexor Kai

    Darth Lexor Kai General of the Future Folk

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2014
    Posts:
    2,340
    Likes Received:
    4,441
    Trophy Points:
    13,852
    Credits:
    9,075
    Ratings:
    +6,077 / 33 / -8
    maybe the next question should be Naboo star fighter vs. X-wing. 4000 years is a pretty big set back. as for the Klingons they might be war mongers but they respect each others honorary positions and military ranking structure. its possible they could overwhelm a peaceful community and steal technology. my point is an individual still has the power to bring a huge change in the galaxy. Luke was a farm boy with nothing but dreams. then within a few years he saved everyone from the oppression of the sith. i understand the artistic integrity here but it still feels like a stretch. Spock might say its Illogical. lol. in the future i really should avoid star trek references. the 2 really have very little in common.
     
  8. Stormagadon

    Stormagadon Cantina Court Jester
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2014
    Posts:
    2,778
    Likes Received:
    29,668
    Trophy Points:
    154,567
    Credits:
    3,866
    Ratings:
    +32,478 / 17 / -6
    Like a couple of the posts made already, it makes sense (somewhat) with the changes between the PT and OT because of the Clone Wars and then the Empire dominating most of the known galaxy, but you're right on the lack of development from KOTOR to Episode 1.

    A half-baked explanation I've come up with is that for whatever reason, technological advances are slow. You have to look at the state of the software, not the hardware. Because from the outside the Millennium Falcon and the Ebon Hawk look pretty much the same, but when you get to the nitty gritty stuff that we can't see, they must be worlds apart.

    Another one is that civilization has pretty much reached its peak in technology, and there are very few advances that happen nowadays.

    I feel like this is Star Wars most fatal flaw: It isn't very consistent when it comes to technology.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. ZebroGodilla

    ZebroGodilla Darklighter Ace

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Posts:
    865
    Likes Received:
    2,900
    Trophy Points:
    10,802
    Credits:
    5,585
    Ratings:
    +3,385 / 15 / -3
    While it can be taken as a flaw, the new Canon has worked to support and accept the abrupt changes. I remember in Tarkin, the Eta-2 Starfighter Anakin uses in Episode 3 is still used as the military begins creating and supplying the TIE fighters, which Tarkin hopes to never fly, and how Vader in a black Eta-2 and a squadron of Y-Wings undertakes a mission. Hopefully, to be even more clear, one of the spinoffs has to allude to this issue and give a better visual understanding why it happened.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2014
    Posts:
    4,391
    Likes Received:
    5,585
    Trophy Points:
    16,317
    Credits:
    6,765
    Ratings:
    +9,458 / 246 / -104
    Well I agree that the tech changes are odd. This is one of the factors that marks SW in general as fantasy not science fiction. Its not a about a probable scientific future its about a lost mythic history with armor and swords and magic powers set in space.

    The other issue is that tech superior to what we see in SW starts to effect the narrative structure. If they add transporters how some of the stories go would change. If they add rampant nano-tech or Minority Report style abundant retinal reading cameras where movement can be monitored automatically you change the style of stories that can be told. Imagine how long Luke and Han would have made it if there were facial recognition on the Death Star? If the Empire used bio weapons why blow up a planet a genetic bio weapon kills everyone on the planet and then virus dies off like it is designed to and you occupy a world with all of its tech and buildings in place all you have to do is burn bodies.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  11. Pobody's Nerfect

    Pobody's Nerfect Jedi General

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Posts:
    722
    Likes Received:
    16,367
    Trophy Points:
    146,837
    Credits:
    14,569
    Ratings:
    +17,694 / 60 / -13
    Great questions, guys.

    When I was a teenager the lack of technological advancement in Star Wars used to bother me, because World War II brought crazy tech advances here on Earth. Computers were invented to break enemy codes, jet airplanes were invented to win the air war, RC technology was discovered to steer torpedoes, even heart transplants came from Nazi experiments on prisoners. When I was a kid the lack of any new techs in Star Wars seems bad.

    But now I think the lack of new techs in Star Wars seems great.

    In Star Trek, the tech is often the story. Got a problem? Tech it! Tech the techy tech to fix the Enterprise's problems, or to beat the Klingons, or to save the world.

    In Star Wars, tech is never the story. People are the story. Got a problem? Send a Jedi. Or a bounty hunter. Or a farm boy, a smuggler, and a princess.

    Star Wars tech is cool eye candy, but George Lucas never let it get in the way of the story. The story is about humanity. Courage. Ingenuity. Friendship. Belief in your convictions. The pod races were about the racers, not the pods. If Gene Roddenberry had done the pod race, it would have been about the pods, not the racers.

    Why did Star Wars fans hate the concept of midichlorians so much? Because the explanation takes the mystery and the magic out of the story and replaces it with tech and science. In other words, midichlorians are too Star Trek.

    I don't want this to sound like a rant against Star Trek. I like Star Trek, but I like Star Wars more, and I like them for different reasons. Mostly it boils down to Star Wars has a heart and Star Trek has dials and knobs. Star Wars is a tale of heroes who use a different technology than we do. Star Trek is a tale of the technology the heroes use.

    With all that in mind, I'm glad Star Wars tech hasn't changed.
     
    • Wise Wise x 2
    • Great Post Great Post x 1
  12. ZebroGodilla

    ZebroGodilla Darklighter Ace

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Posts:
    865
    Likes Received:
    2,900
    Trophy Points:
    10,802
    Credits:
    5,585
    Ratings:
    +3,385 / 15 / -3
    I really like how you explained this. But the retinal data and stuff? That I must respectfully prove wrong. In the first new canon novel, A New Dawn, Kanan and Hera team up with a female alien, forget the species, who scans and checks up on people as her job, which in turn helps our heroes in the narrative. As for Han being caught with visual data? Him and Luke take two of the Stormtroopers out in the Falcon, and then in the prison area that's monitored by sensors and cameras, crashes in and destroys all the cameras. In all, the technology story-wise in my opinion has the technology, but the Empire and The Clone Wars must took the overall galaxy a step back. But again, Star Wars is about people, not tech, so I agree on all hour other points :)
     
Loading...

Share This Page