TFA is about Redemption

Maybe yes maybe not.For me is fight between light and darkness.Believe me this is what SW is ALL about.GOOD against EVIL.For me the Jedi are like Angels of the light.They fight against fallen Angels.This Angels had been in the light.Luke(a Angel)bring back Anakin(Darth Vader)(he was a Angel BUT became a fallen Angel)to the light.Just think about it....

 

No it's not. Finn's journey is more of an awakening, so to speak. In fact, Rey's story is also about an awakening. Also with Ben. An awakening in the dark side. Hmmm... I guess that's why it's called the force Awakens.

 

The SJW Awakens

..just make a comment about people eating burritos in Latin America and they'll become one with the fake outrage, even at Christmas! Hell I could have said hamburger and that would have been acceptable? How does that make any sense? /endrant

 

Star Wars has a lot of themes that are beautifully blended and balanced, allowing many different people to appreciate it. Your favorite theme will jump out at you.

 

For me TFA was about turning my childhood heroes in2 failures.

 

How was it about redemption?
Finn never got a choice and apparently never killed someone or saw real combat before defecting. So nothing to redeem himself for.
Kylo rejected the chance I suppose so maybe for him its about that.
As for Han, Kylo went bad as an adult. I find it hard to imagine Kylo had a terrible childhood that puts the blame on Han.

Especially compared to Child Soldier, Scavenger and Slave.

 

To me ROTJ was about redemption. Lando redeems himself, han goes from scoundrel to war hero. Vader redeems himself. Even 3po, remember he wasn't good at telling stories. Well it was his story telling that convinced the Ewoks to join the fight and ultimately win.
In my opinion TFA is about making the right choices and chosing your own path. Finn makes his decision to defect. Rey decides not to sell bb-8. Rey helps bb-8 get to his base. Han choses to help Rey. On the other hand you have Kylo who is struggling with his decision, when he finally turns to the dark side and kills his father.

 

I have no idea why people insist Vader "redeemed" himself. No, he did not. Just because he killed Palpatine we should forget all his crimes, including murdering children and participating in destroying entire planet? Let's imagine the scenario in which Himmler kill Hitler. So what? Does it redeem Himmler in any way? Redeem his holocaust? And Vader did far worse things than holocaust.

So... nope. I know it has to be shown like that in the movies, I know movies need a "happy end" where Vader could be again shown as a "good guy", but it's very naive. In reality there would be no redemption for him, sorry.

 

Kylo = Yes. Han = Yes,
But I think TLJ will be where we see Finn getting redemption.

 

Redemption isn't soley based on works, redemption is a change of heart, a change of character. Vader changed, killing Palps was a big deal. Vader was the only one who possibly could. If he had not killed him many many people would have suffered.

 

Han did redeem himself in TFA. His attitude towards his son, up until the bridge scene, was outrageous. Not only did he let him go so to speak, making no efforts to reach him, but he wanted to bring a young girl on board. Who, for all intents and purposes, would have been like his daughter. Like a replacement. At no point before Kylo Ren is mentioned by his mother do you get the sense that Han lost a son to evil. It's as if he's childless, carefree like he always was. Then we find out that he actually accepted his son's fate because "there's too much Vader in him". I'm surprised Leia didn't slap him in the face right then and there. Kylo Ren was right, Han would have disappointed her. My guess is he would have dropped her off wherever as soon as he discovered that she's force sensitive (if she came on the Falcon). He didn't want to deal with that when it came to his only son, never mind a strange girl that is literally a female version of his son.
But he did prove that he can be a loving, caring father in the end. He knew that he might die on that bridge, but he realized that his son was worth it. He became aware of all the mistakes he made and he accepted his death, forgiving Kylo Ren. He died for his son, and that's probably how Kylo Ren will remember him. Not a thief, but a father who believed in him. Which will only draw him closer to the light. Han Solo didn't die for nothing, he'll bring his son home eventually.

 

What does Finn need to be redeemed for?

He got force recruited as a little kid. Never killed anyone and left the first chance he got from the First Order.
Even if head killed people for the FO he still have the brainwashed as a child excuse.

That is far cry from Ben becoming Kylo in his 20s.

 

I can't get my head around that's still canon.

 

Thank goodness people like you don't run prisons then. Prison is just as much about offering a chance at redemption for, and rehabilitating inmates as much as keeping them off the streets.

Not to mention the obvious fact that just like Ben, Anakin was manipulated by evil ever since he was a young boy. You are shaped by nurture, never nature. It is possible to be more genetically susceptible to outside influences, but nurture/ environment is always the determining factor. There's multiple documentaries/ court cases on serial killers who had a chance at living a normal life, at experiencing true empathy, sympathy, care for others, but the opportunity was taken from them.

All those German boys who were raised from a young age through the Hitler Youth Camps to become commanders, SS, soldiers etc. Should we never forgive them?

Ironically, the only one demonstrating naivety is you. You're looking through a black and white lens.

 

i think that's how i see TFA, and i believe that will be the true theme for the rest of the trilogy.

i don't like the word redemption.. we all seem to have our own opinion of what that means, and whether redemption is possible for Ben Solo or not.

Can Ben Solo turn away from the dark side and start doing good for the galaxy? of course he can. we know that choice is possible because Anakin made it.
Ben turning to the light is his personal choice plain and simple, and it's a choice he has and will always have.

redemption? forgiveness? they are also choices that Ben himself and others would have to make. I very much doubt that Ben would be able to forgive himself for what he has done.. in fact i imagine that someone trying to live with killing their own father would not be able to become a true jedi knight, as they would forever be emotionally damaged. That doesn't disqualify him from choosing to live the rest of his life doing good.

so no, i don't think the story is about redemption.. but acceptance of fate as @LadyMusashi so eloquently put. In terms of Ben's story.. i think it's also about him accepting his fate - whatever that may be.

 

the tag line for TFA "choose your destiny" is not meant to be ironic.

Finn chooses to leave the FO.
Han chose to try to save his son.
Rey chose to go to Ahch-To and join the Rebellion.
Luke is going to have to choose to return.

who is not choosing? who thinks they are caught in a whirlpool of fate they must accept?
yes, it's Ren "it's too late" Ben.

and yes, this is partly his story, but out heroes are our models.
Ren Ben will either get on board with the ability to choose his own destiny or he'll perish in the Dark.
yes, he could also continue to choose badly, but it's not fate, it's a choice.

and contrary to what many people think forgiveness is also a choice; a heroic one.
perhaps so heroic that people apparently can't conceive of it.

passive acceptance of one's fate, on the other hand, is not a hero's journey.
not ever.

 

but those choices have already been made.. the characters need to understand why they made those choices.

it's a pickle.. no doubt about it

ok, that... might be the wrong film