SPOILER Andor Ep. 7 Discussion

That's fair enough. It would not have been amiss for him just to be referred to as his office. But having his name specified implies the supposed impermanence of his rule. The emergency powers, the extended term of office and the restructuring of the Republic are all supposed to be temporary. "Emperor Palpatine" reminds us that this is just the Chancellorship under a different title. And it's just Emperor Palpatine. And not the Emperor, for good and all. Of course, it's an illusion. That will become clear once the war gets under way. Soon it will just be "His Excellency" and "The Emperor is coming here?!"

 

Yes, that’s true, as Tarkin puts it after the Senate is dissolved, “the last remnants of the old republic have been swept away”.

 

It's interesting how similarly totalitarian regimes can have different character and culture of personality in its hierarchy. The third Reich had "The Fuhrer" (who was also a celebrity under his own name). Whereas the Soviet Union had "Comrade Stalin". Implying that he was just first among equals. Other party and politburo members where Comrade this and that too of course but for the wider public they only really had any prominence when deferred to by Stalin.

 

If Luthen wanted Cassian dead, he would have just told Vel to take him down when the mission was over. It would have saved the Rebels a nice chunk of change and avoided the risk of contacting Vel later.

Kleya (thanks for the name!) is just stone-cold hard and not into playing nice with the other kids on the playground. Remember she wondered to Luthen whether Mon was worth the effort, and she just blew off the deaths of team members of the heist when Vel mentioned them with regret. She is the one who sees Cassian as the risk, not Luthen, to my mind.


Also, on a different note, I just realized the tiny space cubicles in Syril's office are shaped like cogs. Perfect.

 

I don't think Luthen was concerned about Andor until *after* he connected Cassian and Vel on Aldahni. Luthen *may* (we're not sure if it is his idea of Kleya's manipulation) want him dead now because he's a loose end. No matter what the reason may be, it's an interesting twist in the story.

 

It's possible! On the other hand, changing his mind doesn't seem much like Luthen's philosophy of "build your exit on the way in"... Time will tell.

Watching this and Rogue One with all the different philosophies of how to fight the Empire, it's a miracle there was ever a united rebellion at all. So maybe the Force is at work all this time and this really is a show full of mysticism--it's just not obvious. Depends on your point of view.

 

I thought the same thing about the Kleya/Vel conversation- Luthen didn't sign off on Cassian being hunted down and killed. He seems to have put a lot of time and effort (almost getting himself caught/killed on Ferrix) into vetting and recruiting Cassian just to dispose of him after a successful mission. Unless the manner in which Cassian parted ways with Vel changed Luthen's opinion. There is obviously a power struggle and maybe a hint of distrust there, Vel seems a bit wary of dealing with Kleya instead of Luthen and Kleya is almost indignant when questioned. Luthen knows that Cassian has no reason or desire to cause trouble, but he did confide to Kleya that he was worried about "the thief, Andor". That comment alone may have put it in Kleya's head that she needed to clean up a possible mess.

 

Ok, so someone on another forum mentioned that the manifesto is in Cassian's lockbox on Niamos. I researched again, and there is a wallet/folio type item that could be Nemik's. It's hard to get a like angle on both pieces for a comparison but that's one more clue that my flashback theory is wrong. I'm still not convinced that Niamos is NOT a flashback and I feel as though at the very least from a writing and story continuity standpoint, the flashback theory makes more sense. Otherwise there are many plotholes and questions to be resolved in addition to the numerous established storylines.

 

Many plotholes?

 

IF the events on Niamos are NOT a flashback, it brings many questions:
- How much time has passed? His hairstyle is different, arm is completely healed, and he's in a relationship.
-Why would a wanted cop killer bring roughly $200K of stolen Imperial Credits and go hide out on a crowded Empire-controlled planet?
-Has he just given up on Maarva? Bix? Or finding Luthen?
-How is he so seemingly care-free? When we last see him on Ferrix he doesn't seem to be in the mindset of a leisurely vacation with beach bunnies, peezos and greenie green nog... He at the least knows that CorSec and the Empire are actively hunting him, yet he just strolls down a crowded boardwalk unarmed with no attempt to disguise his identity except an assumed name that he forgets to immediately answer to.
-Why was he so naive and passive when dealing with the Shoretroopers? He notices the probe droids, sees the guys running from the troops and is only mildly alarmed (which a petty thief would be...) and then when confronted he merely scoffs and nervously tries to talk his way out of trouble. This is a guy who killed the last 2 cops that hassled him, attacked and robbed an Imperial Garrison, and blew Skeen away without a second thought. But a single shoretrooper has him stammering and sweating?
-We know he's not gonna do 6 years, so what transpires to get him out? Even as Keef Girgo, his fingerprints and his face still belong to Cassian Andor, who is sure to be top of the ISB's Most Wanted and not too far to be tied to the Aldhani Heist. I'd say in the current Imperial State, a captured Cassian Andor would be executed almost immediately.

So now the writers have to resolve all of this in addition to the Ferrix/Maarva/Bix, Dedra/ISB, Syril Karn, Mon Mothma, Luthen/Kleya/Vel hunting down Cassian, Vel/Cinta, Cassian's sister and Saw Gurerra storylines. Even assuming a couple of these run into season two, that's a LOT to tie up in just 5 episodes.

 

To answer those points, all of which can easily be thought through. I’ve edited to number the questions for ease of reference.

1. Weeks most likely. That’s going by the judge’s comments on passing down sentence. “This used to be a six month sentence.” That suggests it’s a fairly recent change still worthy of comment. He’s on holiday, he’s letting his hair down, he’s just up and it’s windy. Not sure there’s anything there to suggest a definitive change of hairstyle. Same with the woman in his bed, nothing to suggest how long they’ve known each other one way or the other beyond a few weeks possibly. The absence of a concrete timeline does not make it a plot hole. He has money now, he can afford to heal his arm and remove any scarring which could potentially link him to the robbery.

2. This is yet another reference to the measures discussed earlier in episode 7. A consequence of the Empire tightening its grip following the robbery. An increased and more visible presence across the galaxy imposing increased restrictive measures, even in places where there may have been a less visible presence. At this point it may be impossible to go a anywhere that’s inhabited and not feel the grip of the empire tightening.

3. He’s doing exactly what he said he wanted to do earlier in the episode. He wanted to take Maarva with him, she wanted to stay so he reluctantly had to respect her choice. Similarly he made his peace and said goodbye to Bix. I don’t think he’s actively looking for Luthen. As he said in ep6. He did his job, he’s got his share for it as agreed and that’s the end of it as far as he is concerned. He thinks he can now move on with his life and leave all his troubles behind. He’s wrong.

4. You think he was care free? He was being secretive in the shower room, on his way to the shop he did manage to crack half a smile but even then he still looked cagey, specially when he saw people running. It’s being so cagey that got him noticed.

5. As above, so not so care free then.

6. Clearly we are about to see what transpires next.

On your last paragraph all I can do is make a friendly suggestion, and that is, calm down! We know this is a show that likes to take its time in telling the story it wants to tell. We’re not going to get everything in one go, nor would we want to. Don’t worry we’ll get there

 

Oh, I agree we'll get there! I'm just worked up because this series is incredible and I'm enthralled by the storytelling. It just seems that if Niamos happens after Aldhani it poses several unnecessary, maybe plot obstacles... is a better term. Flashback or not, it's leading to an interesting story and I have full faith in the Gilroys to do it justice.

 

As @Josep5349 mentioned there are no plot holes here. Andor said he was going start a new life and run away with his credits. That's exactly what we se see some time later. I don't think it's a huge time jump.

Yeah, it's clear he's looking over his back. Even though he wasn't running he certainly looked suspicious before he was arrested.

 

Shmi never told him not to look back.

 

I think I might have miscomunicated my thoughts re: plot holes. The questions that I posted COULD BE issues that would need to be answered. Maybe not... The way the episode ended, and the chronology was very ambiguous to me, and in my opinion, the overall story arc would be better if Niamos was a flashback. I wonder if they didn't want some confusion over the timeline? In no way am I critiquing the writing- quite the opposite- whether it's a flashback or not, it opens several new questions and based on how tight the writing bas been so far, it seems as though they would have to spend valued time to resolve some of these issues.
I still stand on the idea that everything about the Niamos scenes was drastically different. Cassian's look, attitude, the overall feel of the environment, even the music... None of it fit the with the rest of the series.
Man oh man, I hope the remaining episodes continue to provoke so much conversation and debate!

 

Andor will pervert "a certain K-series droïd".

 

I think that's entire point - Cassian is attempting to move on with his life. He's not a thief, he's not with the rebellion, he's just Andor... for the moment.

 

Yeah. All Cassian seems to have on his horizons is escaping to somewhere he can be carefree. Or live as if he is carefree. Even as he's trying to leave Ferrix with Maarva and Bix. It wouldn't take particularly long for "Keefe" with his take from the job to be at leisure to tan himself, get a little bit fat and soft. And for Aldanhi to seem as if it was years ago.

 

Having rewatched the episode a couple times now, I feel fairly confident in saying the Niamos scenes are NOT a flashback. The manifesto in the lockbox and the judge's comment about the new sentencing guidelines are the biggest clues that its just been a weeks since the heist.

I did find it ironic that after Andor's involvement in the heist, he's caught by the Empire simply being an innocent bystander. Can't wait for tomorrow's episode.

 

I agree.

With my 2nd view, I noticed Yularen makes the same comment about the new sentencing.