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SPOILER Beat for beat replication of A New Hope?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Chairman Kaga, Aug 12, 2015.

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  1. Chairman Kaga

    Chairman Kaga Rebel Official

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    I'm just looking at what we know so far, or what we think we know.

    • Kylo Ren and stormtroopers looking for something (Luke's saber) = Vader and stormtroopers looking for something (Death Star plans)
    • Poe hides that something in BB8, a droid= Leia hides that something in R2D2, a droid
    • Kylo Ren gets angry and kills the leader, "The Vicar" protecting that something = Vader gets angry and kills the leader, Captain Antilles, protecting that something
    • BB8 on the run on a desert planet, finds a friend in Rey = R2 on the run, finds a friend in Luke
    • Good guys have to get a ship to get off the planet to get the saber to General Organa and the Resistance = Good guys have to get a ship to get off the planet to get the Death Star plans to Senator Organa and the Rebels
    • Good guys escape on the MIllennium Falcon, but not happy about the hunk of junk = Good guys escape on the MIllennium Falcon, but not happy about the hunk of junk
    ... lots of details we're still missing...
    • Mentor figure, Han Solo, killed by Big Bad, Kylo Ren, and it turns out they have an intricate past and a strained relationship = Mentor figure, Obi Wan Kenobi, killed by Big Bad, Darth vader, and it turns out they have an intricate past and a strained relationship
    • Starkiller Base, capable of wiping out the Resistance = Death Star, capable of wiping out the Rebellion
    Here the space battle seems to skew a bit more toward Return of the Jedi, although...
    • General Organa and Resistance leaders command the battle from a darkened war room while an ominous countdown to their remise ticks away = Princess Leia Organa and Rebellion leaders command the battle from a darkened war room while an ominous countdown to their remise ticks away

    Have I missed any?

    Now I'm not saying this is entirely a bad thing, referencing the original film. But I'm getting slightly worried the script is going to do this a little too obviously and blatantly, and it means the opportunity to do something completely new and different was wasted. I'm just getting a little worried there might be too much, "Hey, remember how cool this was in 1977? Well here it is again!"

    Say what you will about the Prequels, but all three films ran with that idea of showing us a completely new galaxy and plots and characters we'd never seen nor really imagined.

    Maybe it's because we really don't know how the story plays out on the screen yet? I'm sure that's part of my trepidation.
     
    #1 Chairman Kaga, Aug 12, 2015
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  2. Messi

    Messi G.O.A.T.

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    The similarities of TFA and ANH are obvious, and you were wise to point them. I just hope this script/plot has something new that surprise us a little bit.
     
    #2 Messi, Aug 12, 2015
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  3. Kryptic Mind

    Kryptic Mind Rebel Official

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    Not just ANH . I get the feeling JJ is trying to cram his favourite bits of the OT into one movie.The scene with the Falcon flying inside the Stardestroyer looks a lot like the Falcon flying inside the Deathstar in ROTJ. We supposedly have a bar brawl scene ? We have battle on a snow planet .

    Seems to be similarities with characters too. Pure speculation though

    Maz Kanata = Yoda
    Hux = Tarkin
    Kylo = Vader
    Snoke = Palpatine
    Phasma = Boba Fett
    BB-8 = R2D2
    Greg Grunbergs pilot = Wedge ?
    Huge alien pirate with woman on his lap in Maz castle = Jabba

    This all sounds very pessimistic but i am still really blown away by everything i have seen so far .
    I mean they already had me at non CGI BB-8 for christ sake!! :)
    I think JJ is playing it safe a bit but that's fine , i understand. A HUUUGE weight was on his shoulders. The pressure must have been immense. This first episode is the one to convince and win the fans + mass audience back . " Chewie ....we're home! "
    The movies after this one may have more original ideas and the story takes of in new interesting directions. This new development with "The Knights Of Ren" is very interesting for example .
     
    #3 Kryptic Mind, Aug 13, 2015
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  4. DarthPilkington

    DarthPilkington Rebel Official

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    i'm gonna start this off by saying i just saw Jurassic World and i thought it sucked. there were SO many stupid nods and winks to the original that all i could think about was HOW MUCH WORSE THIS WAS. so, with all due respect (@Dark Toilet ), i hope they don't mirror any story. i think that the visuals and the aesthetics are going to be similar and in homage to the OT, but i really hope the story is something we won't expect.
     
    #4 DarthPilkington, Aug 13, 2015
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  5. Zeriah

    Zeriah Rebel General

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    If Han does die is that playing it safe?
     
    #5 Zeriah, Aug 13, 2015
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  6. odmichael

    odmichael Rebel Official

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    I've honestly been concerned myself about some of the similarities. I do hope it is more original than we suspect.


    Well Ford isn't getting any younger
     
    #6 odmichael, Aug 13, 2015
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  7. Dark Toilet

    Dark Toilet Force Sensitive

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    Hey, don't take my comments about ring theory and mirroring the wrong way. I am not in favor of mirroring just for fan service and nod-nod-wink-wink "Remember this from ANH?" It has to serve the story and serve it well. But there can be very familiar themes, especially within a family saga, that still provide a fresh and new story. This is why I like @Snazel's idea for a deconstruction of Luke's story embodied in Kylo Ren... An anti-hero story where he makes all different choices from Luke to be his own Solowalker... That would perhaps mirror Anakin's fall, but I see tremendous opportunity to tell such a story in a much more... satisfying way than we have seen before.

    EDIT: I just realized that you managed to do the near impossible here... you used the dreaded "with all due respect" without immediately following it with something disrespectful! :D
     
    #7 Dark Toilet, Aug 13, 2015
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  8. Kryptic Mind

    Kryptic Mind Rebel Official

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    Of course we are just speculating here but Chairman Kaga said it best
    Mentor figure, Han Solo, killed by Big Bad, Kylo Ren, and it turns out they have an intricate past and a strained relationship = Mentor figure, Obi Wan Kenobi, killed by Big Bad, Darth vader, and it turns out they have an intricate past and a strained relationship

    So to answer your question , perhaps yes.

    In other ways no , i already have seen a few mentally challenged fanboys that have stated they won't go see the movie if he dies but they are few and far between. And playing it too safe is actually walking a thin line and it may become a double edge sword. <----- Two cliches in one sentence!!
     
    #8 Kryptic Mind, Aug 13, 2015
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  9. Grand Master Galen Marek

    Grand Master Galen Marek Jedi General

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    Playing safe? do you mean honoring his memory/legacy, or a faking his death moment.
     
    #9 Grand Master Galen Marek, Aug 13, 2015
  10. Skippy the Jedi Droid

    Skippy the Jedi Droid Rebel Trooper

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    It's like poetry!
     
    #10 Skippy the Jedi Droid, Aug 13, 2015
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  11. Duke Groundrunner

    Duke Groundrunner Rebel Official

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    If it's too much like ANH i'll be pissed.
     
    #11 Duke Groundrunner, Aug 13, 2015
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  12. kayjaysay

    kayjaysay Rebelscum

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    I started worrying the minute they brought up the prospect of another superweapon, which I find just wholly derivative. We've already been down that road in Star Wars. Twice. Abrams and Kasdan are presumably getting paid millions of dollars and had months, if not years, to write this thing. Could they not come up with anything better?
     
    #12 kayjaysay, Aug 13, 2015
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  13. Chairman Kaga

    Chairman Kaga Rebel Official

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    You're getting to the heart of it. You can promote the ring cycle theory through characterization without replicating plot or specific story beats. SOme of the issues I pointed out, specifically Han's death, are necessary for the theory to play out, and also for the original intent of Campbell's Hero's Journey to work. The young hero must be given the opportunity, through tragedy, to realize their potential.

    My concerns are more with plot replication, going back to my original concern that the new film is copying some of the more spectacular components of the original, like superweapons. That has the stink of frustration on the part of the writers, as if they had intriguing characters (they do) and a rich backstory (again, they do), but couldn't quite figure out what to do with them, so they lifted moments and elements form the past and built a new, but familiar sandbox. And yes, I meant Jakku
    : )
     
    #13 Chairman Kaga, Aug 13, 2015
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  14. Cosmic Dolphin

    Cosmic Dolphin Rebel Commander

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    Seems like JJ is compiling a Star Wars greatest hits for this movie..I was thinking the same myself
     
    #14 Cosmic Dolphin, Aug 13, 2015
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  15. Grand Admiral Juno Eclipse Marek

    Grand Admiral Juno Eclipse Marek Guest

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    I'm glad he is so much to choose, mixed it up JJ!!!.
     
    #15 Grand Admiral Juno Eclipse Marek, Aug 13, 2015
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  16. mecano

    mecano Rebel General

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    would be interesting to compare with the original Lucas´ story...
     
    #16 mecano, Aug 14, 2015
  17. DHD

    DHD Rebel Trooper

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    A stormtrooper stealing a tie fighter and defecting from the bad guys has never been done before

    There are most definitely familiar things but there will also be cool fresh breaths of air like Finns escape
     
    #17 DHD, Aug 14, 2015
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  18. Chairman Kaga

    Chairman Kaga Rebel Official

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    Do you mean his outline for Episode VII, or the early drafts for the original Star Wars?

    I'm sure you've seen this site, but if not, here goes your day - http://starwarz.com/starkiller/category/star-wars-scripts/star-wars-star-wars-scripts/
    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 14, 2015, Original Post Date: Aug 14, 2015 ---
    Yeah, true. Of course this isn't a shot for shot remake. I was just commenting there were MANY similarities if not downright replication of plot points and story beats in TFA, at least based on what we think we know.
     
    #18 Chairman Kaga, Aug 14, 2015
  19. Rieekan

    Rieekan SWNN Hawkeye
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    If the rumor is true he tried to replicate the plot points around young anakin/Jake Lloyd. Just with two annoying kids.
     
    #19 Rieekan, Aug 14, 2015
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  20. Bluestreaking

    Bluestreaking Imperial Grand Admiral with Bluish skin

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    While at first I was getting pretty sure that TFA was turning into a retread of ANH, some stuff has changed my mind
     
    #20 Bluestreaking, Aug 14, 2015
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