Bringing balance to the Force

I'm not Pomojema but I hold the same definition of "balance," and I'd be happy to tell you where I got it from.

George Lucas.

This is Lucas' definition of balance. He compared the Sith to a cancer on the Force, and so it was out of balance while they were around. I'm no Force theoretician, so I can't/won't dive deeper as to why they're the cancer and not the Jedi (though Darth Plagueis comes to mind), but "balance" is not about equal numbers. In fact, cancer is probably a great analogy. Your body is out of balance while stricken with that disease, and can't be healthy until it is eradicated. Likewise, at the end of ROTJ the Jedi remain and the Sith are gone yet balance is achieved.

Broken record time for me; seeing as how the prophecy was true and balance was achieved (as per George), what does that mean for our new villains in TFA? Who are they? Where did they come from? What do they want? It'll be fun to find out.

 

I wonder what would happen if a non-jedi lightside force user (say Ahsoka) tried to impose her will on others -- like compel them to govern a certain way. What would the Jedi do? They'd have to take her out, right?

 

I have a very similar viewpoint: The Dark and the Light exist naturally, and the Jedi and Sith represent the physical extensions of each side. So long as there is a Force, there will be Jedi and Sith; "balance" doesn't necessitate equal numbers on either side, though. More on that in a second.

I don't remember where or with whom, but I recall debating the idea that the prophecy wasn't a one-off, that whenever the Force is out of balance a Chosen One will arise to restore it. I hold to this idea, so in my mind the new villains can indeed be Sith (though that alone wouldn't mean the Force is out of balance).

Okay, so if balance is like homeostasis in a body, allow me to toss out my idea: the Sith are not inherently a cancer, but more like fat. A body needs a certain amount of fat to maintain homeostasis, otherwise it will begin to eat itself, but excess fat can throw a body out of whack, even so far as to lead to certain cancers. This ties into the following quote, so I'll finish this in a moment:

I'll agree and disagree with you here; I think certain Sith can become like cancers in the Force, certain Sith like Plagueis and Sidious. The Force was relatively balanced for thousands of years before the PT, and for the Sith to have survived there must have been Sith in hiding that whole time. A Sith using the Darkside is not going to do much to the overall homeostasis of the galaxy; a Sith using the Darkside to manipulate midichorians or cloud the judgement/plot the downfall of the Jedi/conquer the galaxy does throw everything out of whack. So does eliminating nearly every user of the Lightside. Therefore, a Chosen One was needed to facilitate the restoration of balance by destroying the Sith who had caused the cancer: Sidious; Plagueis had already been dispatched by his own apprentice (though he can still return to throw off the balance yet again!).

To round this out, I'll toss out my idea that balance does not mean equal numbers. Any number of Jedi can exist, as they do not "use" the Force so much as they allow the Force to work through them. Sith, on the other hand, manipulate the Force and "hog" it to themselves. Therefore, 10,000 Jedi can exist with only 2 Sith and balanced would be maintained so long as the Sith don't overstep their use of the Force like Plagueis and Sidious. At the end of RotJ, balance had been restored but the Sith will still rise again; it is only when these new Sith decide to take over the galaxy and/or destroy their counterparts on the Light that things get screwy again.

But that's just one fan's drawn-out crackpot theory .

 

I don't know man. Just passing on what the Creator said. I agree with separating the dark side from the Sith. We know from Palpatine that the Sith were doing some pretty unnatural things (cancer). There are many ways to bring back dark side users to TFA, and it's obviously being done. I'm all for it! But if these guys are calling themselves Sith, then there does need to be an explanation.

 

One idea I've heard is that Snoke is a disincarnate sith, and that Ren is trying to resurrect him. Yoda's trip to Moraband showed some odd things of the like.

 

Early rumors cast him (or someone) as zombie-like. But more recent MSW reports make him more like a snoke. I mean, snake. Very much alive. Of course, you're right that there is that aspect of artifact hunting that seems to be at play with Kylo in one form or another. What he's doing - assuming it's him - with Vader's helmet is a big, big unanswered question.

 

ugh...

 

Let's choose not to go down that road, and instead just take things at face value. It's much nicer that way.

 

This'll be off topic, but I actually put some credence into the early leaks of 2014, before "you know who' showed up with his reports. it's possible Serkis might be playing two roles: Snoke and someone secret. Snoke might not even be the big villain of tfa.

you don't have to respond, this is the wrong thread. i feel bad whenever i do that

 

Nice read! The way I always understood the dark side was that it's almost like a narcotic drug. Once you're hooked, it's very difficult to stop using ... even asbit erodes your physical characteristics. Yoda said that once you start down that path, it consumes you. The Jedi certainly weren't infallible, but they also weren't wrong about everything. I really enjoy discussing the mysticism of the Force.

 

This.

It seems that Sith where always the worst dark side force users in the eyes of a Jedi.

 

The prophecy stated the Chosen would bring balance to the force...but never stated how.

Am going to go outside the box and say the Sith were not eliminated, and balanced not achieved, when Anakin threw the Emperor down the shaft on the 2nd DS (but it started to balance out...)

The final Sith threat will emerge in the ST and Anakin, as a force ghost or... , will lead the next generation of Skywalkers (ie- his grand children) in defeating them thus finally achieving Balance and fulfilling the prophecy. Also somewhat explains why Shaw was replaced by HC in the ROTJ ghosts scene.

 

And Tarkin also told Vader he was "the last of his religion" and look what happened...

Cheers, K

 

Good point.

However, by not having any SITH in the ST would really kill the flow of the "Episodes" and technically it would be just a spin off and not a true sequel.

IMO, (Non-Jedi nor Non-Sith) force users/sensitives wouldn't last a minute against a trained Jedi master (Luke) or a trained Jedi (Skywalker descendants).

Anywho we can all agree and disagree.

As long as the story is solid, makes sense and flows w/ the mythology established in both the PT and OT then am happy. Last thing I want to happen in walking out of EP7 thinking I could've wrote a better story.

Cheers, K

 

I like talking about the mysticism of the Force, too. As we know, George Lucas had some familiarity with philosophy, mythology and theology and deliberately incorporated these themes in to Star Wars, which explains why it resonates so well with people.
Anyway, one main topic of philosophical debate is the existence of evil. Is it an independent thing, or is it the absence of good? Most modern thinkers would say it's the latter, but when we run into really bad, evil people it does make one wonder. So this debate that we are having here is one that has been around since the very beginning of the monotheistic point of view, and it's just really interesting to see it discussed in modern science fiction.
That's why Western philosophy had such trouble with Aristotle, who articulated the concept of the Golden Mean. There is no Golden Mean when it comes to evil. You can't strike a balance, or a deal, between good & bad. The goal should be to eliminate the Dark Side completely.