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  1. Imp. Sec. Ofc. Phernaldo

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    I wonder why when Obi Wan and Vader square off in ANH Obi Wan calls Darth Vader "Darth" not "Vader". It'd be like Qui gon calling Darth Maul "Darth". I guess Darth would be a prefix.
     
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  2. daffy72

    daffy72 Force Sensitive

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    Because Darth is his first name, not a title. His title was 'Lord' as in 'Lord of the Sith'

    It was another asinine change made in the prequels. In the prequels Lucas changed Darth from a first name to a title and pulled the gem out of his ass that "Darth Vader" means "Dark Father". It never meant that originally. At some point after Return of the Jedi he learned or someone pointed out to him that Vader is the Dutch word for father. One of innumerable instances where he's rewritten the facts about his 'Saga'
     
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  3. daffy72

    daffy72 Force Sensitive

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    Lucas changed Vader to Luke's father in the draft for Empire in 1979.

    Darth wasn't changed to a title until the draft for Episode 1 in the late 90s with the introduction of Darth Maul. He also gave Emperor Palpatine a title calling him Darth Sidious. He wasn't called that until the prequels came out.

    20 years difference between the two events there.


    The Secret History of Star Wars
    Appendix C p. 475

    BTW that anagram "DARk lord of the siTH" is a popular fan theory from the 1997 Star Wars internet FAQ, not handed down from Lucasfilm.
     
    #3 daffy72, Jan 19, 2015
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  4. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    Darth was a way of expressing a insult to Vader in a low key kind of way. The title is intimidating.
     
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  5. John Crichton

    John Crichton Rebel Official

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    That makes sense. It's rather informal, and wouldn't show the respect that others tended to give him. Somewhat akin to referring to someone as "Captain" but in a mocking way I suppose. Notice how most people -- Imperial underlings, Lando Calrissian, even the Emperor in most cases -- refer to him as "Lord Vader" or some form with "Lord" in it.

    The only other notable use of "Darth" in the OT I can think of when talking to Vader is with Leia, she calls him "Darth Vader" with an obvious disdain.
     
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  6. Voxx

    Voxx Jedi Hero of Legend

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    Great way to put it!
     
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  7. DEKKA129

    DEKKA129 Professional Slinger of Balderdash

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    That's how it always was until Lucas switched it up for the PT.

    And of course, I can kind of see why Lucas felt he needed to address it that way, because otherwise he'd have needed to come up with a justification as to why Anakin would have taken a completely different first and last name when he turned to the dark side.

    My thought on that was always, if the source of the name needs justification, why not have "Darth Vader" be a minor character from some ancient legend in the GFFA around whom Anakin ends up patterning himself (possibly even at Palpatine's subtle urging) as he moves closer to the dark side? And then by the time he falls to the dark side once and for all, he actually believes himself to be the literal incarnation of this legendary warrior?

    OR...

    As far as the whole "Darth as title" scenario goes, it still sounds odd to have Obi Wan calling Vader "Darth" in ANH as though it were a first name. So why not give Obi Wan some dialogue during the ROTS duel (of which I don't think there was quite enough anyway) in which he taunts Anakin about "just being another one of Palpatine's 'Darths' now." Sort of his way of digging at Anakin for throwing his life away to be one of Palpatine's dime-a-dozen punks. That, then, would make the "Darth" thing in ANH a callback to that taunt, which would remove its awkwardness.

    But yeah, up until Lucas began work on the PT script, I don't believe there was ever any indication, even in the rough drafts of the screenplays, that "Darth" was a title rather than a first name.
     
  8. WedgeSalad

    WedgeSalad Rebel General

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    There's no way to explain it without retconning the heck out of it. Back when they filmed Star Wars, I'm almost positive that "Darth" was supposed to be his first name. Fast forward to Episode I, and, for some crazy reason, Lucas decides it's a title--thereby creating a minor, but quite irritating, plot hole that makes a pivotal scene from the OT quite confusing. My guess is that he needed a reason why "Anakin Skywalker" changed his name to "Darth Vader," but chose the clunkiest, head-scratching-est way to do it. What makes his decision even more confounding is that in the years leading up to Ep. I, he did the special editions, so there's no way he just up and forgot the Darth-as-first-name thing. That means he either didn't care or didn't think anyone'd notice. Sorry for the rant--this is one of my most prickly Star Wars pressure points
     
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  9. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    She obviously did not know at the time this darth was her daddy awkward moment that would have been.
     
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  10. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    The Darth as title thing actually works very well in my opinion, much more so than just a random name change.

    I like how it further shows that the darkside consumes you and that your former self is no more (a theme made pretty clear in the OT actually).
     
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  11. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    The darkside has clouded your judgment.
     
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  12. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    Cool story bro.

    The darkside clouds most of your posts, so it's never really clear what you're talking about anyway.
     
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  13. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    You've been keeping track of my posts, good.
     
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  14. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    It's not hard.

    I just watched you in another thread argue with someone when you had the same opinion.

    Your syntax is highly confusing.
     
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  15. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    I guess sometimes I have bad days were I don't the post fully, the I get the ''I Mean'' reply so I missed something darkside clouds seem to be floating around me.
     
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  16. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    This post is exactly what I'm talking about.

    I assume you don't speak English, but how to I read that quote?

    "I missed something darkside clouds seem to be floating around me."

    I'm just saying...you consistently have so many issues with responding in English that it's damned near impossible to know what you're trying to say, and you know it. Like I said, you argued a whole thread with someone because you couldn't make any sense in the argument.

    It confuses people. Do you understand that?
     
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  17. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    Ok lets get back to the Darth thread, I do speak to English, im typing English etc. I hope they think of other sith titles like that.
     
  18. Shawshank

    Shawshank Rebel General

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    Cool (thanks for the dislike for pointing out how difficult it is to follow your illiteracy).

    So what exactly is wrong with the Darth title? What's wrong with taking on a new name?

    Do tell, Grand Master Character That Doesn't Exist.

    I can't wait to decipher this response.

    I can't edit back to my other post but dude... Read your own post.

    Bad days "were" you "don't post the fully?"

    The "I mean reply?"

    It's incredibly difficult to understand what you're actually trying to say a lot of the time. I'm sorry that offends you, but I absolutely promise I'm not the only one who has noticed this.

    English has to be your second language, and that's fine, just don't be annoyed that people find it off-putting to communicate with you at times. Go back and read threads you're contributing to. Notice the trend?

    Just trying to point it out to you because you really don't seem to get it (and for future reference, don't start being "that guy" who dislikes people's posts because they hurt your feelings kiddo...I'll let this one slide).
     
    #18 Shawshank, Feb 11, 2015
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  19. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    If I was to think of another title for Darth I would go for Servus.
     
  20. Voxx

    Voxx Jedi Hero of Legend

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    What @Shawshank is trying to say is, that your punctuation does make it a little hard to understand your posts. He is an English teacher/professor and he's just trying to help you communicate properly. He means no offence! :)
     
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