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SPECULATION The status of the New Republic

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Just Passing Through, Jan 24, 2016.

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What is the status of the New Republic at the end of TFA?

  1. Completely destroyed (JJ Abram's reset button)

    6.3%
  2. Wounded but still alive ("I ain't got time to bleed")

    84.4%
  3. I don't care (Just tell me who Rey's parents are/isn't Rey pretty?)

    9.4%
  4. Other (please specify)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Just Passing Through

    Just Passing Through Rebel General

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    So I made a thread in the ep.VIII section about my prediction for how the war will proceed between the New Republic and the First Order after the end of TFA. However, it occurred to me that it would be useful to get people's opinions and the general view on whether the New Republic even exists at the end of TFA let alone whether it will be fighting the First Order for the rest of the trilogy.

    Thus I have created this poll with a few options for simplicity sake:
    1. Completely destroyed (JJ Abram's reset button): The destruction of the Hosnian system, and consequently the NR senate and Fleet, has utterly annihilated the New Republic leaving the galaxy leaderless and defenceless before the First Order onslaught, which quickly conquers everything. Therefore by the start of Ep.VIII we will follow the Rebel Alliance Resistance in their brave and hopeless struggle against the tyrannical Empire First Order.
    2. Wounded but still alive ("I ain't got time to bleed"): The destruction of NR senate and the majority of the NR fleet is a cruel set back to the New Republic and initially leaves it in disarray/confusion and vulnerable to the sudden First Order onslaught. However, the NR rallies itself around the former Resistance(who have rejoined the official NR military), forms an emergency senate and begins rearming in a desperate attempt to halt the advance of the First Order and their fearsome war machine.
    3. I don't care (Just tell me who Rey's parents are/isn't Rey pretty?): Politics ruined the PT and I don't want to hear anything about it, just put Rey in a room with Jeremy Kyle and get a DNA test from all the characters until we find out who her parents are. In Ep.VIII we'll follow Rey as explosions happen everywhere, lasers fly through the air and Finn occasionally pops up to make a joke all while we have no idea what is happening. Hundreds of dedicated Star Wars fans will argue, debate and investigate in the vain hope of understanding just what in the hell is happening.
    4. Other (please specify): Could you possibly imagine any other scenario then the glorious ones I have outlined above? Please share, jokes will be allowed BUT NOT TOO MANY!
    Obviously my preference is scenario no.2, if that wasn't obvious by my tone and other posts, but feel free to select your preference and explain why, if you have the time, even if it's only to express your complete and utter indifference to this debate.
     
    #1 Just Passing Through, Jan 24, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2016
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  2. Ammianus Marcellinus

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    The second scenario. It would give a sense of urgency to the narrative and the fight against the First Order. My guess is that the resistance fleet will be hunted throughout the sequels only to make a final and desperate stand somewhere in VIII or IX. I do think they will do as little politics as they can. The urgency is with defending a way of living not with debating one.

    Though I do think the resistance should seriously consider defending its trade routes and not allow to much political freedom to private enterprise. Giving the Trade Federation an official voice in the senate was like giving Shell a place on the UN security council.........:eek:

    And while they are at it, they should really grant emergency wartime powers to the new chancellor so that he can govern without the direct approval of the new senate. A Winston Churchill figure will do fine. He will not win the post-wartime election anyway...........:eek:

    Anyway, in the end it is best to do no politics at all. The Star Wars saga posits that the only good guys are the ones who live in undemocratic military regimes with a hierarchical psuedo-aristocratic power structure. For the Rebel Alliance, Mon Mothma, Ackbar, Maideen and Leia will probably tell you what to do whether you want it or not. In the Jedi council the gerontocratic oligarchic council will decide your fate. The Empire would have provided stability and would have had no need for milirary force if it weren't for those mothaf*ing Rebels. Same goes for the First Order. The resistance is a private military organization under the sole leadership of an undemocratically elected general who claims to represent the supressed voice of the people in First Order and neutral space. That is called usurpation.
     
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  3. Trevor

    Trevor Rebellion Arms Supplier
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    Oh yes, the NR is still alive and obviously diminished. We also have to remember that the NR was not only limited to the Hosnian system when it was destroyed, but rotated around the galaxy during elections and was hosted on various other member planets.

    The fact that the new senate was destroyed has no doubt drawn the NR into the war DIRECTLY with the FO, as previously the NR was "officially" not aligned with the resistance...now it's all out war.

    We ALSO have to remember that the FO was not limited to Starkiller, as it was only a weapon OF the FO. We can be sure that (Like the NR) that the FO is peppered throughout the galaxy, and they will both regroup and run head-on into war over this....and it's going to be "gloves off all-out WAR"
    tumblr_mwskxpxtWg1qbwmg0o1_500.gif
    FA.gif .
     
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  4. Ammianus Marcellinus

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    And we must remember that Starkiller was built for one real purpose: to take down the Hosnian system. The First Order clearly has the advantage, despite the loss of Starkiller in an insignificant operation. After the destruction of the Republic the base was redundant anyway. The first order still has its full fleet intact. If those ships in the scene where the hosnian system explodes were indeed the mass of the republic fleet, then the resistance will be even more at a disadvantage. Perhaps the resistance will be more reliant on non-aligned forces and local military organizations than on the former limited military power of the New Republic.
     
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  5. Just Passing Through

    Just Passing Through Rebel General

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    I think following the Resistance do hit and run tactics and constantly fleeing from the FO before making a last stand at the end of the trilogy is too reminiscent of the OT and the Rebel Alliance. This is why I suggest a scenario of all out war between the NR and the FO as fresh take without the Resistance needing to continue to exist.

    Haha, I don't think any of us want a return to the debates of trade sanctions etc.

    I'm not sure they'll grant emergency powers to the new Chancellor, too many bad memories, but I'm sure they'll choose a Churchillian figure to lead them against the First Order. Perhaps someone with experience, a hero of the Rebel Alliance, one of the founders of the New Republic, someone who had the foresight to see this conflict coming but I can't think of who......cough Leia cough

    Agreed, I don't think they'll go into depth on the politics but they at least need to make it clearer what is happening in the galaxy so that many people aren't left trying to figure out what's going on.

    Exactly, I assumed this was obvious but I see in many discussions across the internet that seemed to assume that the Republic is gone, once more. So I assumed that this was the majority opinion and was curious to see if this was the case.

    Again, exactly how I see it. The Starkiller attack was a pre-emptive strike that has launched the FO and NR into an all out war. Thus the Resistance is no longer necessary as an organisation as it was set up to fight the FO because the NR wouldn't but that isn't the case anymore.

    I'd go even further and say that the FO has large amount of military hardware hidden in its territory which was probably mobilised when the Starkiller destroyed the Hosnian system.

    This. Judging from Snoke's casual reaction to the Starkiller's destruction then clearly the FO is not significantly inconvenienced by the loss and probably has large conventional forces ready to take advantage of the damage done to the Republic. The visual dictionary doesn't make it clear whether the FO fleet or the former NR fleet is the largest in the galaxy but I'm assuming they were close enough in size for the former to want the latter out of the way so that they would have the advantage in the following conflict.

    Ah, I think you misunderstood my second scenario, in it the Resistance wouldn't exist anymore as its purpose would be redundant, namely to fight the FO because the NR wouldn't, due to ignorance or simple fear of conflict. Now that there is open war between the NR and the FO the Resistance would surely rejoin the NR, many of them are former NR personnel, and aid in rebuilding the NR military.

    The only way I see the Resistance continuing as an organisation in the rest of the trilogy is if the Republic is destroyed. For me, the Resistance was a nice homage to the Rebel Alliance and a interesting spin on the Cold War scenario at the start of TFA but if the Resistance continues to exist and they intend to repeat the Empire vs Rebel theme then I will be quite disconcerted.
     
    #5 Just Passing Through, Jan 24, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2016
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  6. Trevor

    Trevor Rebellion Arms Supplier
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    Precisely, as the actual "war" that we saw WASN'T against the Republic initially, but only the Resistance. The NR and the FO were basically co-existing in the Galaxy together in a state of "Cold War", and the FO destroyed the Hosnian system because they knew (but maybe couldn't PROVE) that the NR was funding the Resistance.

    At this point, after the strike, the Resistance can hoist the Republic flag that has been hidden away and it's time for official war. I'm suspecting that the Republic has MUCH more military hardware, as they were secretly funneling everything to the Resistance, and all of the hardware that was sent to the Resistance had to come from somewhere! Now there is no use for that secret, and I believe that the Republic will show what it really has behind closed doors.
     
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  7. Rey24B

    Rey24B Rebel General

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    Unless the entirety of the New Republic is confined to ONE Star System, then I doubt that it's been completely destroyed. But it's capital has been destroyed, along with most of it's fleet. And presumably most of it's top political leaders are dead now as well, so there'd be chaos and confusion.

    The Resistance is actually a mostly private group set up by Leia and co to confront the FO more directly. The Republic was supporting them "under the table," but didn't seem to be at open war with the FO. But now, what's left of it (perhaps led to by the newly elected Chancellor Lando Calrissian) WILL perhaps declare open war on the FO and ally with The Resistance more directly/openly.
     
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  8. Ammianus Marcellinus

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    Well I don't mind the resistance having obvious similarities to the Rebel alliance. I do think the rebel alliance was quite a funny organization. "We resist and fight to resist and fight", seems to have been their objective. The original movies did not explore the true objectives of the Rebel Alliance as they are digressed upon in the EU. We only learned that they were trying to restore the republic after the prequels. Instead, I hope the 'resistance' will be more flashed out. That they are actually fighting for something that is made explicit in the narrative of the sequels, that their fight affects people and that there is a certain logic to their causes and the way they behave and conduct operations. A mixture between symetrical and asymetrical conflict would be a nice and interesting twist to the resistance, and it would make it quite different from the Rebels who were portrayed as engaging only in symetrical warfare (at least in the movies). It would fit in well with the more 'moral' undercurrent of the sequels. What does it mean to be good or bad? It would be nice to see this question reflect on the conduct of the resistance. What are the costs of their actions? What sort of moral lines do they need to cross in order to defeat the First Order. With the attack on Starkiller they blew up a planet. That irony must ring with some resistance leaders.
     
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  9. Just Passing Through

    Just Passing Through Rebel General

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    I think both sides knew that war was inevitable but a large element of the NR leadership was in denial because they desperately wanted to avoid conflict. Some agreed with Leia about confronting the FO sooner rather than later and so were quietly funding her Resistance group.

    I should think the Republic has quite a bit of surplus stashed over the place, most of the Resistance equipment seemed to be old surplus, but that their most modern equipment was mostly destroyed during the attack on the Hosnian system. However, I don't think that all of the NR Fleet was destroyed so while the majority of their forces are gone they still have a core around which to rebuild their military, especially with the addition of much of the ex-Resistance personnel who are experienced Generals/Admirals (one of whom is good at spotting ambushes).

    Excuse me, I think you mean Chancellor Leia Organa, or if not her then Mon Mothma.

    I don't think there should be any doubt that if the NR is alive at the end of TFA then open war would be declared, as an protagonist from another saga would say "Open war is upon you, whether you would risk it or not". Again I don't see why they would ally with the Resistance or why they would be separate organisations at all. Any estrangement Leia has from the NR government would evaporate not only because the latter itself has also evaporated but also because Leia's paranoia about the FO has proven to be true: they won't exclude her any more and would no doubt welcome her back.

    The opposite to me then. I wish for them to disappear as soon as possible, they just seem like a needless homage to the Rebel Alliance at this point.

    I think all of these questions of morality are perfectly applicable to a conflict between the FO and the NR.

    The FO believes that he freedom allowed by the latter leads to chaos and consequently needless loss of life, the galaxy is too vast and its people too diverse to be ruled with anything other than power and fear. The NR believed that in peace they would be able to rule the galaxy with a light touch and a less hierarchical system, hence their decisions to demilitarise and the concept of a rotating capital. The conflict would force the NR to make hard choices about centralising power and the role the military power has in running the galaxy. They would have to cope with some systems potentially defecting to the FO, as BTA seems to indicate is a risk, and how to deal with them: would they conquer them and force them back into the NR but this would throw their principles into doubt. How do they balance the correct amount of liberty with the power necessary to defend that liberty?
     
    #9 Just Passing Through, Jan 24, 2016
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  10. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    I think both the 1st Order and the New Republic are wounded and reeling. I don't think they wanted to loose their big stick WMD. The Republic will likely regroup but the defeat of its star fleet and destruction of its central government is going to cause big problems. I would expect lots of systems dropping membership to protect themselves. Others will want to back who they think the winning horse will be so expect systems to align with the 1st Order.
     
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  11. Trevor

    Trevor Rebellion Arms Supplier
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    Yes, and possibly only out of fear of reprisal if they don't.
     
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  12. Just Passing Through

    Just Passing Through Rebel General

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    I expect the NR to be very much on the back foot during the early stages of this war, it wouldn't be challenging if it wasn't, but I don't think the NR will be as much as an underdog as the Rebel Alliance was in the OT.
     
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  13. Boba Fett

    Boba Fett Rebelscum

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    Very intriguing indeed :)
     
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  14. Background Character

    Background Character Rebel Official

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    What happened to Mon Mothma?
     
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  15. Darth Dyne

    Darth Dyne Rebel Commander

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    It's pretty likely that numerous Senators and military leaders were not in the Hosnian system when it was destroyed that can reorganize and lead the New Republic. I mean it would be pretty silly for a galaxy spanning state to have all its government and military assets in one location and then promptly get destroyed in a few minutes. At full strength the New Republic is probably stronger than the First Order. This likely necessitated the Starkiller attack in order to weaken the NR and level the playing field between the two sides in the war.
     
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  16. AstromechRecords

    AstromechRecords Jedi General

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    I think it would be fun to see it loved backed to Coruscsnt .
     
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    DarthCaedus Rebel Commander

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    If the First Order is completely in charge of the galaxy in VIII then I'll probably rage quit and stick to the EU at that point the Sequel trilogy would just be a reboot of the OT in all but name.
     
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  18. TheFettMan

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    Quick ?: Is Mon Marta dead? Is she still the "supreme leader" of the Rebel Alliance? What is her role in the new Senate or Republic?
    I did not read the Star Wars novel: Aftermath. I did see trusty crusty old ADM Ackbar (ackbar) in the war room scenes. So I guess he's still a military leader(fleet CiC?).

    TFM
     
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  19. ArynCrinn

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    Mon Mothma was the first Chancellor of the New Republic. I'm not sure if she's still alive, but at the time of TFA, Chancellor Villecham was on Hosnian Prime when it was destroyed. As far as I am aware, Mon Mothma had no involvement with the Resistance, as Leia was the sole founder of the Resistance, and recruited many former members of the Rebel Alliance to her cause.
     
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  20. Ammianus Marcellinus

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    They pulled him from retirement to give his educated opinion about the size and volume of First Order weaponry......(ackbar)"size or magintude?"

    Mon Mothma, I don't know. is the actress still alive? I hope she married Lando......She always was a politician first, so perhaps she was in the Hosnian system when things went hot. Leia is the commander of the resistance though she might face charges, simply because she's a republic citizen in serious violation of the 'law'. If Republic law is similar to that of present western states and supernational government, she would be facing the following charges(note that her senators who provide funds to the resistance will face similar charges):

    a. Illegal and unsanctioned military operations in neutral and first order territory. Territorial integrity breach.
    b. Unsanctioned use of Republic subsidies and funding (some senators are illegaly funding the resistance)
    c. Illegal arms trafficking. She buys and receives black market arms supplies and actively particpates in soliciting funds to this purpose. Illegal use and appropriation of New Republic arms, vehicles and supplies.
    d. Provoking legal First Order military retaliation because of unsanctioned use of force on foreign sovereign territory.
    e. Illegal use of force and deadly violence by a private citizen.
    f. Usurpation of local power structures and sovereignity. Over-ruling local and sovereign political constellations.
    g. Excessive use of force with grievous costs in human life, have and goods, and mass extermination of transient life forms on the Starkiller base host planet (Starkiller base planetary-wide destruction)
    h. Excessive environmental damage through conduct of illegal military operations (Starkiller base planetary-wide destruction)
    i. Illegal use of New Republic insignia.
    j. Inciting Republic military personnel to defect and enter foreign and illegal military service and engage in unsanctioned use of violent force.
    k. idem to par. j : Republic citizens.
    l. Illegal and unsanctioned military intervention on Takodana.


    similar charges are used for people joining ISIS or any other form of foreign military service.
     
    #20 Ammianus Marcellinus, Jan 25, 2016
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