TLJ In Relation to Other Canon Stories

I'm not the same person I was twenty years ago. A lot of time and history had passed since Anakin died. Why should we assume that Luke would never change? Luke saw the death of his friends at the hands of this boy. The death of everything he had worked to build and for a moment has a point of weakness.

 

1. Luke didn't kill Ben Solo. He thought about it but the moment passed. He didn't see conflict like he saw in Vader, he saw nothing but darkness and still didn't do it.
2. It's not out of character for a Jedi to kill the enemy.
3. Ask yourself, if you knew what Hitler would become and had the chance to kill him as a teenager while he slept, would you do it? That's the situation Luke had in front of him. Unfortunately, Ben Solo saw this and it solidified his turn.

 

He didn't ignore it. He didn't try and kill Ben. He thought about, was ready to act, and stopped himself.

Think about Luke in the Throne Room in ROTJ. TWICE he was provoked to anger and acted to save his family and friends. TWICE! But he also STOPPED himself from killing Vader. Luke IS NOT acting out of character.

Luke's biggest failure was not teaching others about his failures.

 

But how do you do a flashback in a flashback? If you wanted to see what flashback Luke saw in Ben Solo's mind, that would be really weird to do.
Besides, Yoda scolds Luke for not teaching and learning from his failures. Luke wasn't perfect. Luke made mistakes. Yoda wanted him to teach THAT. Not just old Jedi doctrines that MAYBE weren't the best thing to teach a new generation.

 

I agree.

If the entire sequel trilogy revolves around Kylo, then VII should have been about Kylo. The trilogy should have started at the Jedi academy and portrayed his draw to the dark side, it should have set up the characters. Mentioning in both VII and VIII that, oh, it was just Snoke, you know, Snoke did it, Snoke turned his heart... How? Seriously, show how. As it stands, these films are so disjointed and the story is so disconnected, they almost seem entirely pointless. They are directionless.

At the moment, the entire ST is a jumble of mish-mashed characters who are not relevant to the story. This kind of thing would breed cynicism in anyone. They turn Snoke into a story-telling device and *not* a character - total failure. It makes us question everything. What is Finn's purpose? Well we don't really have a story lined up, I mean, he's just there you know... I think Disney said we have to keep so... I know, send him on a pointless aside and make some more janitor jokes! What about Rey? Oh yeah, that was definitely Disney, they said we needed a female lead... uhm... her personality? Her character? A strong personal arc? Oh, Disney didn't mention anything about that... To be honest I never liked her that much, she can stay but only to get it on with my boy Kylo! Oh yeah, Disney did say to put this awesome shot of broom-boy at the end! You know, broom-boy? You'll soon be able to buy his rebel ring in all good Disney stores everywhere! How great is that? Oh by the way, Luke is in it... yeah, had to get that in! Why? I dunno, Disney said people would be mad if he wasn't... and stupid JJ already wrote him in so... oh I got it, he created Kylo... yeah I know I said it was all Snoke, but, then I didn't know how to make Luke important so... Huh, who's Rey again? Oh yeah, she's there so that Kylo can have some to force-bond with. Cool huh! Did I mention Kylo? He's going to be Emperor, and rule the entire galaxy and kill everybody!

They quite literally had no story, and it's more obvious than ever. They focused more on throw-away characters, merchandising and hitting target demographics. As it stands, IX is becoming less about rounding off the saga and more about saving the ST.

I can't believe it's been a week and the film still hasn't stopped bugging me.

 

Bloodlines is entirely told from Leia's POV. We have no factual information on what Ben and Luke are up to. Hell, Leia doesn't even know.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 20, 2017, Original Post Date: Dec 20, 2017 ---

Did Obi-wan ever tell you how Vader was seduced to the Dark Side?

 

Didn't anyone else beside me find it pretty odd that in TLJ it seems that Kylo never worships Vader when in TFA his whole goal was to try to finish what Vader started etc. It seemed that this whole idea of him wanting to be like his grandfather was totally abandoned.That would be fine if there was a long time in between and stuff happened to him that made him think about it all.But TLJ picks up right after TFA.

 

For how bad everyone thought the prequels were, they have comprehensive stories and character development over 3 movies.

TLJ was all over the place with no cohesion. I never felt that the rebels were in any danger becuase the villains are bumbling idiots.

Kylo is just not a believable evil character, he is more like an emotional teenager than cold, calculating evil. The extend of his evil, darkness in these movies was smashing helmets and force chocking Hux, which he could not even do that correctly. Vader would have just killed Hux and got the next candidate in his place. By this point in Empire, Vader has destroyed a planet and killed a number of people.

Rey is just an enigma. Her character has zero depth. They have not spend enough time developing her backstory in the movies. Basically she is suppose to be the hero, but she struggles at nothing, so it is hard to root for her.

Finn could be a really good character. He could be the rouge like original Han, but they give him no depth either. He is stuck in the friend zone of the movies. There for a cool name, but he really does nothing meaningful.

Poe is a terrible character. Ok, so he is a good pilot. He was suppose to creating tension during the mid part of the movie, but he was just whining like another emo teenager.

The Hux character, suppose to be Tarkin, is a joke. Really, a complete and utter joke. He shows no intelligence or anything that would warrant why a person so young is a general.

The problem with Star Wars right now is shallow characters for the new generation and the insistence of killing off the Big 3 characters; the only characters in Star Wars besides Darth Vader that had any depth.

 

Three films of the nine part saga are devoted to it.

This is part 8 of a 9 part story - people keep forgetting that.

 

I agree completely, I always thought this was one of the most important messages of the whole saga. In my interpretation the jedi order was decadent and full of hubris, except for perhaps Qui-Gon who was often at odds with the council, they were not very wise at all and in many regards not better than the sith. They were no longer guardians of peace and justice but instead fighting stupid wars and meddling with politics.
The most important point in Luke's story arch to me is that he transcended all this, he realized that the true light side choice was compassion and self sacrifice instead of killing your enemy, the sole idea that he even contemplates murdering his nephew in his sleep is a complete regression.

 

this is tantamount to people extrapolating that Rey must be related to some Force dynasty.
we all made assumptions because we were trying to fill in what felt like missing pieces
but there's obviously more to the story than we imagined.

Bloodline never confirmed that the reveal of Vader was the cause of Ben's fall.
in fact, it tells us that Leia doesn't know where Ben is and that he and Luke have been out of contact for some time.
we have no idea if her message reaches him or whether he's already been long gone before she even tries .

fair enough that we drew conclusions, but there's no contradiction.

 

When he tried to seduce Rey to join him his goals sounded very similar to what Anakin told to Padmé and later Luke, so in that aspect everything still holds on.