An excercise in tolerance.

I like and dislike the new sequel trilogy so far.

Visually and other elements are fantastic.

I dislike some of the story elements and the direction of the overall arc.

 

I like TLJ now although I felt confused and unsure after the first viewing (even after divorcing myself of expectation).
I've mixed feelings about certain things but find it hard to say I “dislike” or “hate” what didn't sit well with me.
If the justification for them is reasonable I just accept them like I accept multiple opinions on the film that are thoughtful and make sense.
(Tolerance ☑)

Some flaws I accept because of how storytelling works.
I figure it's like building a house within material constraints yet working on different sections at different times.
Maybe I didn't like some of the brickwork but that foundation is likely there to provide function for some of the things I did like to stand on.

Other flaws I'm ok with because of how art for public consumption works - you give an artist the resources and hope for the best.
It's never going to be perfect and sometimes it will miss completely whether it was discussed in a committee or was just one person's project.

I thought some of the pacing was odd but I accept editing is often about compromise.
Sometimes you're faced with a choice that will hero either the flow or impact of scenes and you go with a decision.

Some of the things I felt weird about at first I can accept because it made the most sense to the writer with the hand they were dealt.
It makes it easier when I learn they did their due diligence when coming up with the story.
I can accept things eventually had to move forward at the risk of some of the things I held dear.
Given the choice I'd rather chance being challenged than risk repetition or stagnation.

Some of the pacing and humor issues I had are probably there just for the kids and I'm cool with that.
It's give and take with family films and it went both ways in my showings:
During one of my favorite scenes the 9 year old I was with covered her eyes and ears!
I liked the length but during another showing the 7 year old I was with fidgeting in his seat by the end!

tl;dr - loved it from viewing 2 thru 4, have mixed feeling about some aspects, and respect the different opinions about it that are thoughtful and coherent.

 

Overall i largely dislike the film. While RJ's direction was good (visually) his writing is poor. I knew something was up when (paraphrasing RJ) "i moved Kylo's scar because visually it looked silly".

Well canonicaly thats like switching Luke's robot hand. He refused to work with what came before & i didn't like that at all. Also the saga has bin about a family, learning the Force & good vs evil.

Now it about a nobody, greying of the Force with no Training & a pathetic romance. All witch cheapens what has come b4. Another thing i despised.

I dun with 8. Bring on Solo.

 

Looks like there's some confusion about point of this thread. Here's the OP.

 

Ok. Well i did like the Hyperspace Ram. The Supremacy looked cool. Nice 2 c Yoda again.

 

Liked the movie overall.

Didn't like -

Lorna Dern as Holdo. Just didn't feel like a military leader to me
Fathiers. Unrealistic speed and athletic ability for the size. Found it distracting
The First Order couldn't jump in front of the Resistance fleet? Color me unconvinced
The throne room fight. Once Snoke was dead there was absolutely zero chance either Rey or Kylo was going to die at the hands of the reds
The incompetence of the First Order
Canto Bight

Did like -

The sexual tension between Rey and Kylo. She loves him. Hates him. Tries to kill him. Tries to redeem him. Wants him. Wants him dead. It's complicated
How easy and natural Snoke used the Force
Captain Kanady
Rose Tico. She doesn't understand battle tactics or war strategy but she's in the Resistance because it's the right thing to do
Luke's understanding that the Force doesn't belong to the Jedi, it binds all living things, not just those who can manipulate it
The silent, beautiful destruction of Snoke's ship when Holdo's ship went through it. So artistic!
Kylo Ren, conflicted
Luke brushing the ashes off his cloak
The cinematography. A beautiful, beautiful movie

 

Yeah I got a bit lost trying to intellectualize my mixed feelings in my post. I'll try again..

I liked TLJ but would have preferred to see Luke ignite the green on Craite.

I believe the director explained the reasoning as helping Luke troll Kylo (my words) and as a cue for the projection ruse.
I guess I feel Kylo seeing the saber that triggered him when he last saw it ignited could have worked in the same way but avoided the need to explain that Kylo was unaware it had broken.
(It also would have looked awesome and may have been worth it just to give Steele Saunders the warm and fuzzies.)

 

Ok so I think the request was to play devil's advocate (if you liked it, say what you didn't like, if you disliked it, say what you did). In an effort to honor that request here is what I liked about TLJ
1. It was visually one of the best ever
a) The throne room
b) The throne room fight scene
First ever multi vs multi energy melee weapon battle in an Episodic movie and it was arguably the best scene of the movie
c) The light speed attack and how it was depicted was excellent
There is Physics that support the reason why it made sense for Holdo to do it in this instance whereas it wouldn't make
sense to have tried it in other instances, a lot of which has to deal with density and mass
d) The Canto Bight Casino
e) Crait (above ground and below ground)
2. Leia being an active instead of a passive Force User
This was a serious oversight in past movies and (I felt) pushed Leia off the front stage. She is the daughter of
the chosen one, there was no reason for her not to exhibit active Force Usage. It was finally corrected here
(even if you don't like the way she did it, she should have been an active Force User)
3. Rose mourning the death of her sister
Another oversight of the SW franchise was to have (as I have described before) a few mournful looks and sad beeps when someone died, but few depictions of genuine emotional loss when someone died. The only time we've seen it was with Anakin
and Rose. They need more of this and I'm glad TLJ showed it
4. Demonstrating that Kylo had intelligence along with great power
How many of you all would have thought of a way to kill someone who was more powerful than you and could read your mind?
How he quickly diagnosed that Rey knew her parents were nobodies and that she should be able to relate to his feeling of abandonment

 

I really liked the cinematography, the production design and the film has a lot of thoughtful ideas. I really loved the performances of every actor. Kylo Ren really grew on me this time around and the fight scene in the throne room was superb.

I strongly, strongly disliked the way Luke was written. Don’t get me wrong, those scenes with Luke are strong but if you look at it in the larger part of a 9 film saga, it does not make sense to me, (To Me). The guy who saw good in his evil father would not creepily sneak up in his sister’s son’s tent and contemplate killing him. Granted, Luke lost it when Vader threatened to turn Leia but that was the point of Luke’s arc and he only fought with Vader after resisting that temptation. I just don’t feel that enough information was given.

I was frustrated by how Rey was used. I didn’t want a copy of Empire but I wanted to see more exploration of the force. I know we got too see her force Skype with Kylo Ren but I wanted to see more growth from Rey. I wanted to see Luke actually train her. I liked her first lesson with him but I do feel that those conversations were going in circles.

I also liked how Luke died. He simply went out like Obi-Wan, that was how I always felt Luke should go.

I liked how they referenced how the Jedi were stupid and blind in the prequels but I feel like the deconstruction of the Jedi went on for too long. I feel like more exploration of the this ancient Jedi Texts would have helped understand the world more.

Rey not being a Skywalker is fine, in fact if they didn’t want her to be Luke’s daughter I’d rather they made her not related to anyone. However, you tease people with questions about who is Rey in the first film. When Rey mentions her family, you start to wonder who are her parents. Why did they leave her on Jakku as we see the ship fly away(doesn’t jive with them being junk dealers).

Also, her just being Rey was a problem. She doesn’t have a last name and so you start to wonder who is this person. I don’t think TFA defined her very well and in here, she is just a catalyst for Kylo Ren. If they wanted her to be not related to anyone, that should have been in the Force Awakens, and they should have kept her name as Kira Rey. No one would have asked if she’s related to anyone and I doubt there would be this much backlash about her heritage. Not having a last name doesn’t make her stand out as much. Notice Han wasn’t just Han, he was Han Solo just like Luke was Luke Skywalker or Lando Calrissian.


I liked the idea of killing Snoke midway through, but the problem was they didn’t establish his motivations or why he was doing all this in the first place. I know people reference how we knew nothing about the Emperor but that was an archetypal conflict. We are in part 8 of a 9 part saga so bringing this ancient powerful guy out of left field does require some explanation. Otherwise, it just comes off as a remix of the OT, which I really didn’t want.


I also wish Finn and Rose had more to do. I found Rose sacrificing herself to save Finn to be silly because the “saving what we love” becomes laughable when behind them a death laser is about to kill everyone. But in both movies, Finn is portrayed as so over the top and isn’t taken seriously. John Boyega himself has expressed some dissatisfaction with how he was used as just a goof.

Poe’s story with Holdo felt forced. I understand why Holdo doesn’t tell Poe her plan but the idea that Poe gets to pull a mutiny and get away with it, I’m sorry but that’s just ridiculous. It makes it hard to sympathize with Poe or for me to take this Resistance seriously. Not saying they should have done it this way, but I feel that Poe should have come with both Finn and Rose to Canto Bight, where we get to see some bonding and see Poe feel responsible for Leia being in a coma.

I liked the film but just didn’t love it but I am glad it worked for a lot of people. At the end of the day, there’s gonna be so many SW films that it’s impossible to please everyone.

 

R2 playing Leia's hologram.

 

What I liked:
-Luke's character arc, the way Luke had that moment of thinking to kill Ben was ingeniously done; hints that even though he's been the hero, no hero is perfect.
-The visuals
-Porgs
-Snoke's death
-Canto Bight (very interesting planet, hope it's expanded on)
-Yoda reminding Luke that failure is the real greatest teacher
-The last scene (force-sensitive poor kid looks up to the stars)

What I didn't like:
-The story played it too safe
-The colour of Holdo's hair --- doesn't suit her

 

So I think this is what @Sparafucile means:

I loved the film. If I had to say what I didn't like about it:

- The sense of scale. From the battle of D'Qar to the battle of Crait, a lot of the moments that should've felt bigger just... didn't.

- Luke's force projection. I get why they did what they did, but it would've been really satisfying to have Luke there in the flesh

- Luke's death. Again, I get what they did, but I really wish he had survived.

- Leia's unconsciousness. Wish she'd been around longer in this film.

- Would've liked more Phasma

- Would've liked more DJ development

- Would've liked Poe to have been in an X-Wing a lot more

- The ending was... strange. Again, I think I understand what they're doing, but I did kinda wonder on my first viewing why RJ thought he should end the movie with a scene featuring a character no one even really knows about. With such iconic ending shots like:

Spoiler: ending shots

... and really, more than just those in this series, having a final shot of the random kid just left me feeling kind of empty on my first viewing.

 

disliked the movie but...
Mark Hamill, Daisy Ridley and Adam Driver acted well
Luke vs Kylo duel was pretty amazing

can't remember what else was good, only saw the movie once

 

i loved TLJ. things i'd have done differently:-

• Hux. i think he was on the receiving end a little too much. i would of liked to have seen him dishing it out by the end.
• Leia in space. i kinda love the scene, but i get why others don't. i would have had her use the force to protect herself from the initial blast in an equally epic way.
• Phasma. a little part of me thinks the backlash from TFA about her character made RJ go the way he did with the Finn vs Phasma fight. they gave her a 'semi' win in that fight. i would have given her something meaty to do earlier in the film.. and had Finn win the melee fight without falling over the side like he did.
• i would have taken one or two bits of humor out. no specifics as i laughed at each of them first time through.. perhaps some of the jokes on Ach-To. 1 or 2 too many there methinks.

 

Did not like TLJ at all.

However, things I appreciate in the film...; Umm.... ummm.... damn, can't think of anything!!

I kid, I kid...

The things I appreciated are as follows;

The Rey/Kylo dynamic - The presentation and interaction to be specific, not the reasons for their interaction.
Adam Driver in general.
Badass Luke at the end (even though it wasn't really Luke).
Mark Hamill in general.
Wise Leia dealing with, and mentoring, a hot head Poe.

Struggling to think of anything else. Open to suggestions.

EDIT: It appears this thread is accomplishing what the "common ground" thread set out to do.