SPOILER ANDOR EP. 11 DISCUSSION

So you know, you did not offend me. We're all just throwing out hypothesis. I enjoy the conversation and differing viewpoint.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 16, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 16, 2022 ---

I guess I could see that if the Empire were, for lack of a better term, spiking her drink. But it seems like there are too many town people concerned for all of them to be in on the Empire's side -- the Daughter's of Ferrix, etc. I can see how the Empire (specifically Dedra) would want to lure Cassian back in through any means necessary, of course.

 

Wow. I'm confused and a bit surprised by reactions here. Nothing happened in this episode?

My first thought as the final credits rolled was, "man, A LOT happened here!!" It would have been extremely weird if just all of a sudden, every character happened to be in the same place at the same time for no apparent reason for what was the inevitable showdown needed to wrap up the season 1 arc. This was by far the busiest episode of the season. Just about every character in the series was active, across a crazy number of locations, having deeply important dialogue and interactions. If we have learned one thing from this show so far, there is no waste. There has been little to no filler.

Most of all, the lines are becoming clearer. The "gray area" is becoming narrowed. Luthen and Saw speak the words- "For the Greater Good." Luthen is openly torn over the Kreyger situation. Melshi is genuine and driven to do the right thing. "What if we're the only ones? Someone has to speak up!" I believe that Vel sees the potential in recruiting Cassian as opposed to killing him and she sees the writing on the wall. That's why she's headed to Ferrix and so desperate to reach Luthen. They are all acting consciously and unselfishly. They're looking like "The Good Guys".

On the other hand, Dedra and the ISB are callously using Maarva's funeral as a trap. She eagerly tortures and kills to prove that she is correct in her thinking. Syril also sees an opportunity to use Cassian's grief as a tool to get his comeuppance. He is so self-righteous that he is willing to act illegally and immorally in order to serve his idea of law and order. They have both clearly left the zone of ambiguity and are full fledged "Bad Guys"

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 17, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 17, 2022 ---

Dude! Did someone hack your account? You are one of my favorite conversation mates on here! The whole point of being here is to see different perspectives and interpretations. Can't we all just get along?!

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 17, 2022 ---

Maarva's dead. I really had hoped for a better Rebel death for her, but this does make more sense. Plus we see when Cassian reaches out to Ferrix that he was not planning on going home, and he needs to for the conclusion. Besides, Maarva's scenes in ep.7 are hard to beat.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 17, 2022 ---

Not a lightsaber... although it looked intentionally like it could be. Pretty sure that's the same walking stick he carried on Ferrix. It has a metal piece that telescopes out of it, very much like a lightsaber. He also has the Kyber pendant and his ship obviously has kyber-powered components. Based on his occupations, he surely has interacted with a few Jedi, but I don't think he is one himself.

 

I think, after seeing Luthen's apparent need to disguise himself, his comment last episode about "an equation I wrote 15 years ago," his Kyber necklace, his Jedi and Sith artifacts, his ships "lightsaber" weapons, and that strange tubular device he says to "put down or give it back to me," when at Saw's camp...

15 years ago, two things happened. The Emperor rose to power, and the Jedi were wiped out. While Palpatine taking his power is indeed a thing that could raise one to fear--and thus planning--I think the loss of the Jedi is a much more personal thing that would make a someone "write an equation."

As for the tubular "weapon," "put it down," makes me think he didn't want the guard to play with it too much--even if the guard didn't hand it back, Luthen wanted it out of the mans hands.

I have always thought the line in ANH, "There will be no one to stop us this time," leads me to think that there were a few Jedi that had been troublesome over the years, an Luthen was one of them.

 

"Put it down or give it back" is a strange line, and it's odd that any issue was made of the thing at all. It could be, or could have been a lightsaber... It's almost a given that in his dealings with both antiquities and contraband weapons and devices that Luthen has come into possession of such things. That wouldn't make him a Jedi. 15 years before, Luthen would have been younger, but still roughly middle-aged. He wouldn't have looked much different, and let's not forget that currently the Inquisitors are hunting Jedi to far corners of the Galaxy. He's right down the street from the Jedi Temple on Coruscant. Also, his belief system is miles away from that of a Jedi. He is a man of mystery, and I can't wait to learn his backstory, but I'd be very surprised if he was or had been a Jedi.

As far as Vader's "There will be no one to stop us this time." Yes there were some troublesome people causing trouble...the Rebellion. But I took that line was in reference to the Emporer dissolving the Senate.

 

I’m keeping an open mind, though I think we shouldn’t forget he has collected numerous artefacts, most of which are in his shop, some Jedi related. Given that, it may well be that at some point he discovered old Jedi/Sith/Other tech and adapted his ship. But, you never know! I wouldn’t rule anything out when it comes to him.

 

Wow, that's a good point. For some reason, I didn't even register it as a lightsaber but it could've been one. I don't feel Luthen to be a Jedi, though, even with the kyber crystal and potential lightsaber, but he could definitely be a Whills/Force; another tie-in to Rogue One.

No worries, mate. It was a fellow mod I pissed off. I'm gonna do better and pull my feet out of my mouth.

 

I've been thinking, does anyone find it hard to believe that the Empire never realized that they had actually captured Cassian? They have his face. Surely, a simple name change shouldn't have worked.

 

In Star Wars? Nah. Nobody checks random Stormtroopers walking a bloody Wookiee into the Death Star detention center and Kenobi went into hiding on Vader's homeworld using his actual last name and official Jedi uniform as a disguise, so why would one assume the Empire's criminal databases were linked up across a gazillion worlds.

 

It would be convenient if the Empire already had some face recognition tech that monitored every prisoner to see if they are a fugitive under a different name.

But it's far more plausible and thematically relevant that Andor was picked up for no reason and given a harsh sentence in order for the empire to meet its targets for production and the whole system is simply not designed by some super genius to leave no place for enemies to hide etc. "Nobody is listening" in the Imperial regime, unless you really force them to. Or the listener has ulterior motives to just being a good listener.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 17, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 17, 2022 ---

If you were slightly disappointed by Ep 11, there's probably one very simple explanation. Andor doesn't really do anything. Or say anything. He's more or less passive for the entire episode. He doesn't even have an argument with anybody. The most that he does is call home to send a message to Ma and receives the bad news.

So it's no wonder if you feel the "quality" dipped or the episode was lacking. You're just wrong though.

 

I'm not saying the episode was bad.

 

Second part wasn't directed at you. It was a separate post.

 

The "prison transfer" scene clearly didn't work though. As far as Obi is concerned, I doubt Vader had any intention of ever returning to Tatooine.

 

OK, guys, I'm confused. I must have missed some nuance in the subtitles with the big alien guys on Narkina 5--why did they decide to give Melshi and Cassian a ride off the planet? Just to spite the Empire, or...?

 

They might still figure it out. The Disney+ description of ep.8 is: "The Empire catches up to Cassian but are as yet unaware of his identity and past." That hints that they will eventually figure it out.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 17, 2022, Original Post Date: Nov 17, 2022 ---

Yep. They were upset because the Empire had come in, built the prison and upset their environment, specifically the water and fishing supply. Despite a reward of one thousand credits per escapee, they chose the anti-Imperial route and flew Cass and Melshi to Niamos.

 

This seemed to me like a pretty strong set up episode. We've got an Andor/Karn/ISB/Luthen crew showdown coming on Ferrix. Mon is going to give her daughter away which will be agony for Mon, but it seems like her daughter won't mind. That's pretty much it for loose ends. Saw seemed to be on board with Luthen's plan. So we have one big set piece left on Ferrix.

 

Luthen's line, "Put it down or give it back," may have just been a red herring but that's when it hit me that it was more dangerous than a mere walking stick.

We've seen dual-sided light saber staffs, perhaps Luthen has a 'hidden-in-plain-sight' one that telescopes to a walking stick on one end but (with the right touch) can turn into a deadly light saber on the other end.

I know, I know, it's a very far-fetched notion and I thought twice about sharing it. But the more we see Luthen --- especially in THIS episode --- the more I suspect there's more to him than we know.

Nevertheless, I'll expect to proven wrong in the finale.

 

Thanks for clarifying, everyone.