SPOILER Obi-Wan Kenobi Ep. 3 Discussion

I'm loving this series so far. I may be wrong, but I think Vader kept Obi-Wan alive (meaning out of the fire) because he wants a shot at trying to turn him to the dark side. Think about it, the entire arc of the Sith is you become the main bad guy's Sith apprentice, then you groom your own Sith apprentice on the sly, and then the two Sith underlings team up to unseat the Master. Then the cycle eventually repeats.

Vader's problem is that in 19 years he never found anyone who was strong enough to help him defeat the Emperor and take over, but the hatred of Palpatine and lust for power is still there. Luke was the only one who might qualify...if Vader could somehow turn Luke to the dark side. He tried openly at the end of Empire Strikes Back and in the novelization of Return of the Jedi he was still trying to do it, which is why he did not want Luke to kill the Emperor on Death Star II immediately. If it's 10 years earlier, who's the only Jedi in the galaxy who might just be the Sith padawan Vader's looking for? Why, his old Jedi Master of course!

My prediction is that the next time these two meet (and of course I could be very wrong), Vader will try hard to turn him, Kenobi will be tempted but will tell him no, Vader will try to kill him, Kenobi will then proceed to seriously kick Vader's ass, and I say this for two reasons. To justify the casting of Hayden, we need to see him his real face and body outside the mask. How better to do this than to have him be seriously damaged, sort of like the Vader at the end of Force Unleashed.

But then, once Vader's damaged and vulnerable, Kenobi perhaps starts fighting his own dark side temptation to strike Vader down then and there. But maybe he doesn't, rather, he tries to bring Anakin back from the dark side. There has to be a justification for that line from Return of the Jedi where Luke tells Vader to "let go of your hate" and Vader tells him, "Obi-Wan once thought as you do." Maybe Obi-Wan tries, even plants the seed by admitting that Anakin didn't really kill Padme on Mustafar, but then when Vader refuses to turn away from the dark side, Obi-Wan leaves him broken and beaten. Vader doesn't seek out Obi-Wan going forward because he's afraid of Obi-Wan's regained abilities, but Obi-Wan doesn't want to go looking for a fight with Vader again. When the two meet again in Episode IV, neither really have the stomach for another round, but Obi-Wan knows he MUST do whatever it takes, even sacrificing himself, to ensure Luke and Leia are able to escape.

 

I finally got time to rewatch ep. 3 and man, is it hard to see Obi-Wan in this fearful and somewhat powerless state.

(Fortunately my subconscious knows how it ends. )

 

Vos Vos Vos Vos Vos !!!!!!
Overhyped - been waiting for this for too long!

Best episode thus far - for me there's been a few off points in scripting (third sister character depth) and some odd direction choices (Leia beating Bolts 100m sprint world record) but otherwise very pleased so far.

 

JAMES EARL JONES!
JAMES EARL JONES!
JAMES EARL JONES!

Also, James Earl Jones.

 

the comicbooks are being used due to the marvel cinematic universes' success



Its been done in Marvel Star Wars issues 21 - 37 (aka THE BAD BATCH IMHOP)

Plot: Vader commands Sergeant Kreel and his SCAR Squadron to take down the rebel base in Horox, hoping that they might find Luke Skywalker. We also get glimpses of Sergeant Kreel’s motivations which run much deeper than his desire for self-preservation. Later in the book, Luke, Leia and Han must deal with the aftermath of SCAR Squadron’s attack.








According to the official Star Wars website, these Stormtroopers will cameo in issue #20 of Star Wars before starring in a standalone story shown in issue #21 that will then lead into the The Last Flight Of Harbinger arc proper. As it turns out, we’ve already met their leader, Kreel – who was previously identified as the Gamemaster in Showdown On The Smuggler’s Moon. Kreel, while operating as an undercover Imperial agent for Grakkus the Hutt, trained Luke in order to keep him alive long enough for the Empire to capture him. Obviously, that last part didn’t work out as planned, but there should be an interesting dynamic if the two face off again.

 

This was the series I have been MOST looking forward to. I always thought the prequels vastly wasted Ewan as Obi-wan. Unfortunately it seems he is being wasted again. I’m just pretty disappointed by the first 3 episodes. Like Mando (which I think has been ‘ok’) and BOBF (terrible) the SW Disney+ shows all lack the cinematic scope that helps makes SW movies events and special. While I think the overall story arc for the series is pretty interesting (I don’t care if it kind of tweaks parts of the OT lore) the series doesn’t come close to living up to any of the films. The sets are lame, the Volume is vastly overrated and cannot replicate the scale and scope of real world sets and the directing of the action scenes and chases is shockingly below anything in the movies. It’s just frustrating. The story they are telling about Obi-wan done for the movies with the quality even of Solo would be off the charts. Unfortunately what I see is something that feels more like a fan film budget than what Ewan and his character deserve.

 

I feel the same way. In fact, the "snap" as people are calling it, was disturbing enough to make me stop watching the series altogether. Unfortunately, I don't think there's anything more I need to see here.

I'm sorry for being such a downer. Here, I'll do a quick paraphrase:

Ben - "This is not the show you're looking for."
Me - "This is not the show I'm looking for."
Ben - "You can go about your business."
Me - "I can go about my business."
Ben - "Move along."
Me - "I'll just move along then."


I hope you all enjoy of the rest of the story, though! I'll probably get around to reading about it later on Wookieepedia.

 

That was the impression I got as well. It was painful and terrifying to watch, more so than Rogue One, but I think part of that was 1) it was random civilians, and 2) we know he’s only doing it because he wants Obi-wan to show himself. And it shows that he is willing to do what he needs to do in order to hurt Kenobi and find him.

 

There's nothing deep about this story yet. But, I'm glad they made Vader ruthless, violent, horrific, terrifying, pure evil, at the peak of his power, dark, angry, vengeful, blaming. This is not the smiling, redeemed Anakin we see after he throws the emperor down the tubes. We're reminded without doubt that he was shockingly bad, not our friend or nice Hayden, but a dark killing and destruction machine at this stage, doing the bidding of the devil. I didn't think it was over the top compared to the violence pumped into our homes on screens daily. We are supposed to feel repulsed and horrified. We're also shown that Reva is an amateur compared to Vader, with no doubts who is the power in the room. They needed to remind the audience that he's the bad guy-- as bad as it gets, and the absolute darkest part of your own psychology that lives inside of you. The worse they make him, the bigger Luke's victory in ROTJ. If they don't make kids cry and wet their pants when they see Darth Vader, they didn't do it right. He shouldn't be a happy, cute plush toy on beds, but the monster under the bed.

The drone scene reminded me of another movie:

I thought about the name Leia chose, Luma. It's not only another light reference. It's also an anagram for Maul. Just an interesting tidbit.

 

Totally agree. They should have thrown more talent, time and money at this.

My aunt (who saw Star Wars in 1977) put it best today: "If it was wine, it would be a two year aged $40 per bottle wine.. not the expensive vintage which most of the movies have been. Ewan Mcregor's acting is the LAST thing wrong with the show and deserves better."

 

What I would really love to see near the end would be something like the Ashoka-Anakin/Vader moment (at the temple) but a bit extended; 30 seconds of Anakin resurfacing and a brief dialog:
Vader: Obi, I can't come back.
Obi: I know old friend. I will do what I must.
That would break me. Even a small variation of this and I'll become a Disney fanboy.

 

It isn't a continuity error.

The character's disposition is discussed with Vader and the other Inquisitors as well.

The reality is this is a coven of evil and no one gives a crap other than how it may benefit them.

Reeva obviously lied and blamed the attack on Obi-wan but I see little reason to believe anyone would care any more if she just fessed to it. It may have actually been to her credit.

Vader doesn't give a damn about such things to be sure, his ambition is to kill his master as well as his master did his and in turn expects to be killed by his own apprentice one day.

If the Grand Inquisitor was too inept, weak, or foolish to defeat the least of his order then good riddence to bad rubbish is the most probable way about all involved would chalk it.

I think you are focused on a cultural norm that doesn't apply and twisting it into an error that doesn't exist.

No one in universe actually cares (in a non self serving fashion to their own benefit) other than the victim himself.

If Vader doesn't care and the Emperor doesn't care then it is a non-issue, no Imperial Department of Justice will be investigating nor will there be Senatorial investigations to get to the bottom of the matter

Plus, like 65% chance he will be back. Not that that matters much either way but I think he likely comes back for revenge, which is also perfectly acceptable.

No one slipped up and forgot that the Grand Inquisitor was supposedly killed, it is discussed in universe it is just bugging you that it isn't a big deal for some reason despite there being no in universe reason for ANYONE to behave any differently.

 

Sorry for an OT kneejerk response, but any SW series that includes The Return of the Mandalorian--Episode 5 and From the Desert Comes a Stranger--Episode 6 (arguably among the best SW TV shows ever filmed) cannot be 'terrible.'

Yikes! Makes you stop and wonder why Disney was quick to announce halfway through this limited series 'production crap show' that it's coming back for a second season.

 

For me, those two episodes were the worst parts of "The Book of Boba Fett". They didn't belong in that series and both episodes bored me senseless. If it wasn't for the seventh episode, which was the finale, I would have completely dismissed "Boba Fett". Also, Djin Djarin and Grogu's arc in the sixth episode made me realize how completely useless Luke's appearance in the Season Two finale of "The Mandalorian" was. My initial reaction to that episode wasn't that great. And now I see why.

 

In all honesty, I would have bet the farm that no true-blue Star Wars fan would ever find fault with an episode featuring Luke training Grogu -- with a dash of 'Ahsoka and Luke together' thrown into the mix.

Obviously, I was dead wrong (yet again.) It's another good reminder for me to never assume anything on this forum.

 

I've been waiting for you, Obi-Wan. We meet again, at last. The circle is now complete. When I left you I was but the learner. Now, I am the master.

 

It's by far my least favorite scene in the entire show, and one that triggered me a little due to recent events and personal reasons (similar to the reasons Logan triggered me.*)
Still, I think it was a necessary one. Episode 1 teased out the harming of innocents to find Obi-Wan, and the show needed to deliver on that. As a fandom and as a cultural landmark, we have this "cool, mysterious, awesome, threatening but only to those who fail him or his enemies" persona of Vader, but outside of Rogue One, he hasn't really killed a lot of people (on-screen) in the Disney Era. I won't say he's softened, but there's a soft sort of persona around him, I think. Or maybe I'm projecting. This scene really put that harsh, brutal, cruel edge back in place. I didn't like it, but I feel like Vader needed it.
After seeing the scene twice though, I don't think I need to see it again.

I'd suggest expanding that to the fandom as a whole. Star Wars fans - or those who call themselves Star Wars fans - are capable of great good and great evil in the name of Star Wars. Great acceptance and great exclusivity. Great mercy and great cruelty. Just like people everywhere. A fan's reason for loving Star Wars can be as varied as the fandom itself. Some may just like the music. Others like shipping or memes. Still more may have a personal connection due to seeing it in the theater for the first time, be it A New Hope, The Phantom Menace, or The Force Awakens. And someone is bound to love the thing you hate while someone else is bound to hate the thing you love. We're lucky if they're willing to explain it, we can understand it but still disagree, and we can reach an agreement to disagree.


*I have a feeling that I'm going to be making a lot of Logan comparisons in the future, and not for the better...

 

I tend to think this 'Evil Star Wars Fan' business has been overblown. But that's not unique to Star Wars fandom -- Everything tends to get overblown in this social media age. Give a SW fan a reason to 'fall in love with Star Wars again' (i.e. The Mandalorian, Obi-Wan Kenobi) and past sins are all but forgiven (or at least ignored )

However, it seems to me though that there's a type of fan we see here who have some magical standard in their heads that leaves everything that's coming from the franchise underwhelming. Hey, certainly no one is going to accuse me of blindly fawning over everything Star Wars but on the other hand, the vitriol coming from some posters regarding a quality show like Obi-wan Kenobi leaves me scratching my head. For some reviewers, if a SW show is not Citizen Kane, the production is automatically a piece of garbage. When all is said and done, George Lucas always intended Star Wars to be a fun, Flash Gordon-ish adventure for kids -- and kids-at-heart. In the immortal words of Sargent Hulka in the comedy classic, Stripes, 'Lighten up, Frances.'

 

I really don't understand what the problem with this series, or overall with the "new" SW is.

Plot holes ? Well, here is an idea. X wants to hide Y from Z, so he brings Y to a relative of Z -who Z knows- gives him the surname of Z, and registers this name/surname (Check comics if you want) where Z can access at any point. Now, obviously this is beyond stupid, right ? What is the first thing one does when he/she is hiding or hides someone ? Change the surname. Right ?

You think ^ is pure cretinism ? Wait. A super intelligent machine builds millions of infiltration units and they all have the same face. No, I #$#$ you not. Millions of infiltration units have the same face.

So OT has a meteor-sized plot hole (one among so many). Terminator plot makes you think a high class troll got millions of funding to make a movie.

Peps know ^. They fly with it cause its a fairytale and that is that. If ^ are acceptable then Obi1 series is really well written.

So, what's the problem

 

Eh, I don't think it's unique to Star Wars, but it's sure not overblown from where I'm standing. The evil and pain people inflict in the name of Star Wars is real. The problem isn't the "Star Wars fan" needing a reason to fall in love with Star Wars, it's how said fans react when things aren't what they wanted or like. Complaining on a forum is fine and if done well a great outlet. Harassing an actor and being a cyberbully isn't, no matter the reason. Fans who harassed KMT because they didn't like her character in TLJ but "fell in love with" The Mandalorian are still problematic, because the problem is THEM. They inflicted pain on someone completely undeserving of it; the answer is more complicated than "give them something to fall in love with," because that doesn't fix the root behavioral issue. It's like a child throwing a tantrum at dinner because you gave them green beans instead of chicken nuggets. They don't have to like the green beans, but the answer isn't in acquiescing and giving them chicken nuggets every meal because that's what they like either.

So what happens when the internal kid in said viewers isn't on a happy adventure? Is the show wrong? Are the kids who watch and the kids in us just not getting it? I don't think anyone here is automatically failing the show. People here are giving it a good shot, finding that it's not fitting their needs at this time, and moving on. If they've done that with other shows and have found a pattern with what Star Wars is creating and their own Star Wars needs not being met, then that's fine. It's not some mystical, impossible bar to meet. It may be chasing a high, but I haven't seen a single person here that hasn't pointed to something else Star Wars has done and said "I don't even like that; I like the OT exclusively." I don't think it's surprising or flabbergasting that some fans here or elsewhere may not like what Disney has put out. They're not forced to, and everyone is an individual with different experiences, backgrounds, and criteria when it comes to Star Wars. Maybe it's because I've been avoiding spoilers due to me watching late, and thus I've missed most of the conversations, but I haven't seen a lot of vitriol. I've seen frustration and annoyance, and pretty healthy reactions to that via discussion when possible and passing on the show if it's not enough, but I haven't seen vitriol.

Obi-Wan isn't a fairytale though. It exists in the same world as a fairytale, but it's not using the same logic, theming, atmosphere, or tone. You don't compare Casablanca to Saving Private Ryan despite them happening during the same time period, so why should Kenobi be held to the same standards as the OT? Different things that live in the same world can be held to different standards and still coexist.
(Just to clarify - I have no real qualms with the show so far other than it not being as fun to watch on rewatches. However, I do see and understand with some of the complaints of the show, and would like to give voice to those just in case those who feel that way don't see this or don't feel comfortable responding.)