Poll: Did You Like TLJ's Characterization of Luke?

And you don't see the difference between those two situations? His father was much farther gone along the darkside, he was also his enemy and they fought on several ocassions, but still Luke refused to kill him. Kylo is his nephew and his student and he contemplates murdering in his sleep and he ignites his lightsaber? It's a complete regression of his character, an insult to Luke's story arch through the OT and how he surpassed his masters and redeemed his father through compassion.

 

I fear this is starting to sound like the old "Han shot first" arguments.....but....I believe Luke fingered his lightsaber ignition button then stops.....Kylo wakes up, sees him standing above him, force pulls his saber to his hand and ignites and Luke parries....

 

I voted in the middle, but I'm between there and full approval, just need to sit on it or see it again. To all those saying certain things were out of character, we're talking about over half of his life ago, things change. His confidence has been shattered, he feels he's failed as the jedi have in general. I don't think anyone here that's over 30 can say they haven't changed in even 5 or 10 years.

 

Well to be honest I don't remember exactly if during the final flashback he ignites it or not, but that is besides the point, he still considered it and that is enough imo to portray Luke as completely out of character.

 

Have you seen the movie too or are you also ignoring the context?

Luke saw a future where Ben killed and destroyed everything that he loved. In a fleeting instant he had the urge to stop it from happening and in a flash, the thought was gone. As per Luke's own words:

"I saw darkness. I sensed it building in him. Then I looked inside and it was beyond what I had ever imagined. Snoke had already turned his heart and he would bring destruction and pain and death and the end to everything that I ever loved because of what he would become. And in the briefest moment of pure instinct I thought I could stop it. It passed like a fleeting shadow and I was left with shame and consequence. And the last thing I saw were the eyes of a frightened boy whose Master had failed him.".

Luke is a man, not a God. In Vader he saw the good that remained. In Ben, he saw darkness. Even Leia admitted to be wrong about the light left in Ben. Luke's moment was a flash of desparation. However, as fate would have it, Ben happened to feel it.

 

I wish there were an EPIC post button instead of just a "great" post....yeah.....what @TheBBP just said.....BTW did you get the script?

 

Seriously, now you're using box office money as an excuse?

That's exactly what George Lucas did; he hired Michael Arndt for the screenplay and JJ Abrams as the director. He wanted to tell an original story, but then Disney came along, chucked it all away, and decided to repeat ANH because it was a more financially secure investment. Disney don't care about their brands as much as they claim, they've been doing this to all their franchises for decades.

 

There was audio clips on the internet. They have been since taken down.

 

The Yoda scene really helped bridge the eras and Luke’s problems that have always held him back.

We’ve seen Luke think things are impossible.

We’ve seen Luke leave his friends while they are being hunted to go on a journey of his own.

We’ve seen Luke jump off a ledge in an act he’s lucky didn’t kill him to escape his problems.

Take all those on-screen faults, throw in tragedy and the stages of grief. Throw in middle-age contemplation. Throw in the fact that the cycle does tend to repeat. Throw in the fact that he’s projecting his real issues of guilt onto the order as a whole because he’s ashamed that the Dark Side he’s known for years was horrible for his family called and he answered briefly. The decision to film the scene from different perspectives like Kurosawa’s Ran also hits on a timely message. That what we think went one way in our minds may have impacted another person much more seriously than we realized.

It’s the worst aspects of Luke coming out in a believable way following grief and Dark Side flirtation for a family famous for Dark Side weakness. Luke needed to accept what happened... even if Ben had interpreted it worse than intended... to heal and become balanced with the Force. It’s hard to imagine a more thought-provoking examination for Luke Skywalker and I loved many of the ideas and themes explored.

 

Of course I saw the movie, that does not mean I have to agree with you. As you said, Luke is a man not a god, deciding to kill someone because of a vision is below him, that was the mistake his father made and he is above that. The Luke I know would have tried to save his nephew no matter what.

 

He still sold it. If he cared enough to see his vision through he wouldn't have sold all the rights. As for the box office, to get over a billion dollars, a film needs repeat views from a lot of people. If the film is bad, the box office will show it. Especially domestically. Also, you have the conundrum of the reviews for this film being overwhelmingly great.

A bunch won't like it, that is just how it goes. That isn't a signal that they did it wrong.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 17, 2017, Original Post Date: Dec 17, 2017 ---

He didn't decide to, it was a fleeing emotion.

 

Oh, for Hutt's sake, I give up. Talking to you is like talking to a brick wall!

 

How DARE you!? Only my wife gets to talk to me like that!

Enjoy your night.

 

That's fine we have different opinions I just don't think Luke contemplating killing his nephew in his sleep fits with his character in any way.

 

You too .

I mean, it's I, your wife! You're sleeping on the couch tonight!

 

Luke never considered killing Kylo -- it was a "moment" of "pure instinct" that "passed like a fleeting shadow". It never entered his mind, it was just an instant of pure gut reaction -- based on the fact that he'd actually looked into Kylo's mind and seen what was there! He was guilt ridden over nothing -- if you positively knew that someone wanted to and was capable of killing at least 13 people (Luke and the other Padawans) you wouldn't experience at least one moment of revulsion and panic and think, "Should I do something about this?" No one "created" Kylo -- Ben Solo created him because he wanted to. The moment he killed Snoke it was clear that no one was controlling him -- ever. A lot of people are missing how RJ parallels Kylo and Luke in this movie -- they both wanted to get away from their legacies -- Kylo was willing to do anything to attain that goal, Luke wasn't, it's what makes Luke a better person than Kylo. Luke finds a way, a better way than opting out, without resorting to violence. Luke frees himself and attains peace. With every destructive act Kylo damns himself deeper into a personal hell because he's nowhere near as stoic as he thinks he is. Luke was a broken man who found his way out -- Kylo just keeps breaking himself more. Great storytelling!

 

But there was light left in him. We saw it when he refused to kill his mother. Or was that scene, very good btw, supposed to imply something else?

 

Those who vote for the 1st option have given themselves to the dark side!

 

While we may never agree, I still think it was a terrible decision story wise, your words help me in trying to reconcile with the story that was chosen, even if I don't like the story of this trilogy so far I will still keep watching star wars and try to enjoy it for what it is now.