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SPECULATION Rey Kenobi

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' started by DailyPlunge, Mar 31, 2019.

  1. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    There was a time that I think this or even that she was a Skywalker was possible. But I think that at this point her being from a non-legacy family is important as one of the many opposite character points she has with Kylo.

    Kylo is the privileged assumed heir who when denied it will burn the galaxy down to get what he thinks he wants. Rey is the true heir chosen by the force. If they tack her onto Kenobi's family she loses part of her distinctive.
     
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  2. Jedi MD

    Jedi MD Jedi Commander

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    I was on board early with liking the idea of Rey being a Kenobi. However, at this point in the story I think it is best to just leave her from a non-special bloodline.
     
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  3. eeprom

    eeprom Force Sensitive

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    The character’s most proactive display in the story is killing his master - an act entirely in service to this ideology he’s attempting to press onto Rey. It’s the underline nature to their particular conflict. Similar to the Killmonger character everyone loves so much from Black Panther, it isn’t the ‘what’ of his perspective that’s villainous, but ‘how’ he intends to fulfill it. Kylo isn’t wrong in his assessment of Rey. She IS stuck in the past. She DOES need to move on in order to move forward.

    Like Luke, his goal is to destroy what’s come before - to “burn it down”. Yoda’s lecture to Luke is the central thesis of this storyline: However flawed, the past has value. It can be learned from. You can’t just discard it. *BUT* you also can’t allow it to dictate your future or that of those who would come after you - you need a balance between the two extremes.

    TLJ reinforces the theme TFA initiated with Rey’s arc. What she seeks isn’t behind her, it’s ahead. She isn’t defined by her past. She’s isn’t the sum worth of where she’s from or who she’s related to. Who she is is something she has to discover on her own and for herself. Linking her now to some legacy that’s otherwise irrelevant to who she’s become undermines that character growth that’s been earned. And for what exactly?

    “You have no place in this story. You come from nothing. You're nothing.”
    “Nuh, uh. MY grandpa was YOUR grandpa’s teacher. So . . . there.”
    “Wow . . . touché.”
     
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  4. lealt

    lealt Rebel Official

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    My answer... that would make Obi Wan a character like many others we’ve already seen (and quite a yerk too).
    I don’t need another romance nor another bad/tormented father-child relationship.
    What makes him unique is that his is another kind of story.
    And as long as things stay for what they are he did fail, with Anakin. As a human being may do.
    But he find a way to amend... to be to the Jedi he wanted to be.

    I find fascinating exactly that.
    That his commitment, his life is still human, but it’s not ordinary.

    And his sacrifice to save the lives of people who were not his kin, is the most selfless and compassionate of the entire saga.

    Obi Wan is great, just because is a man that struggled (a lot) to stay true to his values.
    That’s my honest opinion, nothing more.


    As for the “poetry” the best way to end the saga in a full circle is by killing off the Skywalker’s bloodline.
    That would do.
     
    #24 lealt, Mar 31, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2019
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  5. ObeeJaun

    ObeeJaun Rebel General

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    I don't think she was a nobody in the beginning, but she is now. JJ could say "you are a nobody" is a lie, and he may, but I don't think they are going to go against RJ's story, I think you are going to have a hard time explaining away the cave scene. They already feel that they screwed up on Solo (which I disagree, it's in my top 3 SW films), they would never imply that TLJ was a screw up. They will hold the company line and say it was a success.
     
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  6. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    What would this accomplish exactly? The move will be out soon enough. His job is to make the movie. He doesn't have to police fan theories.

    It's quite possible Kenobi plays a part in IX and it has nothing to do with Rey.
     
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  7. Use the Falchion

    Use the Falchion Force Sensitive

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    That's a growing trend though, and if they're willing to make Han and Leia unperfect parents (I mean, given how their family turned out in the Legends story, I can only assume they were that already) as well as the controversy around Luke (regardless of what side you fall on, there IS controversy), I don't think Obi-Wan would be spared.
    As far as Obi-Wan being a jerk, as awesome as he is, he's already kind of a jerk. Or at least shady. Granted, most of this is due to Lucas' habit of retconning, but it's still there.

    Which is why there is the option of him simply not knowing his child during his lifetime.

    Agreed!

    Agreed here too!

    I...agree less here, but I see your point. I'm not ever sure Obi-Wan found a way to change as a Jedi, or that Luke can fully count as his redemption for failing Anakin, but I see your point.

    Honestly that's a perfect saying and I couldn't agree more. My post was more of an exercise that they could do it, but keeping both Obi-Wan and Rey blameless and independent respectively would be hard to do in the eyes of fans frankly.

    And we're gonna have to agree to disagree on this point. ;) ...even if that means I have to accept "Ben-demption"...urgh...
     
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  8. Grand Admiral Kraum

    Grand Admiral Kraum Force Sensitive

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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    This has been my theory since December 2015:

    During The Phantom Menace era (or possibly before) Obi Wan returned to his home planet of Stewjon.. and had a secret affair with a woman from the royal family there. She gave birth to the mother/father of Rey.

    Fast forward to Rey as a child - she is ousted from the royal family at 7 years old (for her Jedi abilities) and left in the care of Unkar Plutt.. who is kept on a payroll to stay quiet. This was done partly to protect her, as the Jedi were being hunted down.

    This explains why she heard Obi Wan's voice prominently in the flashback, her force abilities AND how well-spoken she is. Being related to Obi Wan gives her a huge connection to both trilogies, and allows her to relate to Luke and Leia in a satisfying way.. while bringing the Skywalker saga to a close. The Kenobis will become the main bloodline of the saga after Episode IX.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  9. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Rebel General

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    Back when I theorized Rey was a Kenobi, it involved Obi-Wan either hooking up with a handmaiden during their temporary Tatooine exile in E1 or - perhaps more likely and less salaciously - hooking up shortly after the end of E1 with a handmaiden he met and got to know during the aforementioned Tatooine exile.

    I mean, Rey certainly has a physical resemblance to Keira Knightly's Sabe - which, of course, also implies a physical resemblance to Padme herself but I think that would have been going too far.
     
    #29 Wolfpack, Apr 1, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2019
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  10. Apollus08

    Apollus08 Rebelscum

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    You are right. I looked it up. Still not sure where the ages became canon. But that probably does mean Rey is a nobody.
     
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  11. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    Star Wars: The Force Awakens: The Visual Dictionary establishes her birthday at 15 ABY. Ben Solo was born in 5 ABY.
     
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  12. Angelman

    Angelman Servant to the Whills & Slave to the Muses
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    While I never particularly needed Rey to be a Kenobi (although I certainly think it could've worked worked quite well), my championing of that theory back in the day was based on storytelling logic centered on her several seemingly shared visual story beats in TFA with Obi-Wan in ANH, and the fact that Obi-Wan spoke Rey's name in the Forceback. That Rey turned out to be a nobody doens't bother me in the slightest for her character, and I REALLY like the political statement that this story choice establishes in Star Wars (i.e. anybody can be a jedi and anyone can seek to do great things, no magic-blood required; same goes for my gal Rose, by the way). However, I do question the wisdom of depicting Rey as Kenobi-esque in several scenes/beats in TFA, and the inclusion of Obi-Wan speaking her name in the vision if this doesn't mean anything. I am sure we'll get some weird and/or wonderful explanation as to why Obi-Wan was "there" in the vision at some point, but from a filmic point of veiw it is a very weird red herring. (As others have stated above, I believe it is quite possible that Rey was originally POTENTIALLY Rey Kenobi in the scripts and conceptualizations, but that this was changed to Rey Nobody at some point when it was already too late to take the Kenobi-esque stuff out, or JJ simply didn't want to take it out because it is actually rather great stuff in TFA).

    So, yeah, Rey Nobody is great! Although her seeming connection to Obi-Wan in TFA is weird now. And I suspect it will remain weird in the films as I cannot imagine JJ suddenly changing the Rey Nobody thing now unless it is for a VERY critical story point in Ep.IX (i.e. a twist on the level of "I am your father"; certainly, a throwaway line like: "Ooops. Sorry Rey, you were wrong about your origin 'cause you've actually been a *suspensful pause* Skywalker/Kenobi/Palpatine/Solo/Calrissian/Antilles/whatever the entire time!" would be pitifully bad movie making at this point).
     
    #32 Angelman, Apr 2, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2019
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  13. Ender

    Ender Rebel Trooper

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    I’m a big fan of this idea. I think it helps to unite all 9 movies more.

    Kenobi didn’t have to take it upon himself to be the kind of factor he became in the Skywalker saga but he chose to. He wasn’t written as someone whose parents were famous Jedi. He wasn’t written as someone who became good because the Dark Side did something awful to his family. Kenobi simply was good because he chose to be and committed to the fight against the Dark Side because he wanted to and stayed devoted to the Skywalker family because he chose to.

    Opposite Vader’s grandson, who is named Ben, this whole time we’ve had other members of the famous Star Wars storyline but no Kenobi. Luke was written deliberately in VIII to not be Kenobi-like either because there really is a Kenobi in this story and it’s Rey as the granddaughter of Kenobi.

    It will be Luke returning the favor of mentoring the granddaughter of the man who helped him in IX. It will be the grandchildren of the last Great War that started this whole saga in IX.

    For a Vader wannabe who told her she was nothing to realize that girl he said was nothing is actually related to the guy who trained and beat his grandfather in battle and trained his uncle who bested him, and who his own mom and dad may have named him after would be a huge paradigm shift for Kylo Ren. She’s not nobody. She’s the granddaughter of the man who helped Anakin prepare to build that saber and trained him how to wield it and the Jedi who had that saber in his possession the longest single time period. The Jedi who was involved in both generations of Skywalkers. That saber called out to her through that connection to it and she went back to pick it up as her grandfather did on Mustafar all those years ago.

    She’s the only known relative of the missing ingredient of this trilogy. A key ingredient that was there in the other 6 stories. Someone J.J. purposely set up to speak with her and had Ewan come in for. All this from a filmmaker who sees his own grandfather as being most like him and not his own parents. A man that loves his own grandfather so much that he purposely puts an Easter egg related to his grandfather in most of his films. A man whose entire mystery box claim to fame came from his own grandfather and that trip to the magic story.

    JJ loves Obi-Wan and his own grandfather and hasn’t been lying at all because it was never about Rey’s parents. It’s about the personal choices she made to connect herself to his troubled family just as her long lost and unknown grandfather had. That’s her connection to this story and this trilogy’s connection to the other 2 sagas.

    It’s the twist that he knew he could pull off on most of the general audience and still will. Risk set it up for him perfectly with the focus on the people who raised her on Jakku. He can set up a surprise with her perfectly now that ties everything up.

    And if you think the presence of the Satine Wren story in a cartoon J.J. has likely never seen, with ratings that are a tiny fraction of who will see IX, will stop it from happening i think you’ll be surprised. They’ll do it and then let the story group work out the logistics later and likely devote an entire Kenobi movie on Disney + to it later.
    --- Double Post Merged, Apr 2, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 2, 2019 ---
    I apologize for the double post here but what I’m going to share is a mock up idea of how they could get to a Rey Kenobi reveal fairly naturally for anyone wondering how it could be done.

    REY: I’m sorry.

    LUKE: Don’t be. I made my choices.

    REY: Leia sent me there for you. I have seen the island in my dreams since I was a little girl. If I’d have stuck to the plan and been more patient and not listened to Ben Solo you’d... you’d still be alive.

    LUKE: A wise friend once told me the future is always in motion. You believed you had made a breakthrough with Ben. That he would change for you. I know how it feels to believe like that. Hope is a power I never want you to lose.

    REY: I misread what I saw. I saw Snoke dead. I believed if I went to him we would win.

    LUKE: A part of me thought you might as well.

    People with our gifts see things that others do not. It’s rarely the gift one would assume. It’s always shrouded in darkness. Years before I met you I saw you and I on the island in the tree too. It’s why I went there. Before I lost my way. Before I let you and my family down. It is I who was weak and foolish. I took the quick and easy path of avoidance. Anything to avoid realizing that I’d let the Dark Side in again. That others lost their lives because of me. The darkness consumed me on the island slowly. Until I was wearing my own kind of mask. Just like my father.

    REY: I guess we both have regrets.

    LUKE: And we may have more before this is through. Regrets can be learned from. Failure is a wonderful teacher. I saw something else. The end of war. Through you and Ben.

    REY: But how?

    LUKE: That is what we must find out but I have discovered a clue. Rey, I now know why our fates are intertwined. Why you and I were meant to meet. Why this cycle has repeated. Why you and Ben are drawn to each other and oppose each other.

    REY: I don’t understand.

    LUKE: so much has become clear from here. Our families... They’ve intertwined.

    REY: Interwined how?

    LUKE: What drove Ben Solo to the Dark Side?

    REY: Snoke?

    LUKE: Yes and more... legacy. A misplaced belief that Darth Vader and our bloodline were meant to rule.

    REY: What does that have to do with me? Why did the saber call out to me?

    LUKE: You are the last living descendant of the man who trained him. Who bested him in battle. Who helped teach him to build that saber you’re holding now and who held that saber for a generation and gave it to me. Who trained me. Who Ben was named after. Who helped our family defeat the Dark Side.

    REY: Who? Who was this man?

    LUKE: No, Rey. Not was. Is. He’s here with us now. He’s always been with you... but he couldn’t interfere.

    REY: I don’t see him.

    LUKE: Close your eyes. Take a deep breath. Let go of what you perceive of your family history. Of what you know. For all families have secrets both light and dark.

    OBI-WAN: It’s too soon for her, Luke. She’s been through too much.

    REY: Who was that?

    OBI-Wan is pleased.

    OBI-WAN: I’ve gone by many names.

    REY: Grandfather?

    OBI-WAN and Luke both smile.

    OBI-WAN: Yes, Grandather will do... Grandfather will do just fine.
     
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  14. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    The forceback scene in TFA was one of the last things completed a few weeks before the film was released. At that stage the script/story for TLJ was pretty much done (JJ would have know the story at that point). They had even filmed some stuff on the Island. So JJ did the Obi-Wan stuff after knowing the story to TLJ.

    Make of that what you will.
     
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  15. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Rebel General

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    I agree with this 100%. I like that Rey was a nobody because I don't want Star Wars to overdo the whole "this person is secretly related to that person" trope. However, as you point out, there is certainly a discontinuity between E7 (which sets up a connection) and E8 (which disregards it).
    I think JJ has a lot of leeway to sort of retcon things back to his original idea if he wants to. It would be very easy to establish Kylo Ren was lying to her when he said she was a nobody and she was simply misinterpreting her own feelings on the matter or whatever.... I don't think he will do that but he could quite easily....
     
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  16. Lambergoon

    Lambergoon Rebelscum

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    I

    Well, I still say her name is actually a pun: "No-Wan" of "Gno-Wan", something like that. So she is literally no one. That is her given name. But she is also connected to Obi-Wan somehow. To get there, you have to remember how important prophecies have been in all the Star Wars movies, but we don't have one in the new trilogy. Or we don't think we do. But we actually do. "No-Wan will stand in our way", misheard and misunderstood as "No one will stand in our way." tumblr_osnrfwzWRc1w6j24yo1_1280.png
     
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  17. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Jedi General

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    It's worth pointing out that before TLJ came out a plurality of people who discussed Rey's parents believe she was related to no one. Some people assumed Rey was connected, but upon closer inspection this was an expectation that people took into the theater. None of the Solo clan act like she's a relation. Really the biggest thing was the saber calling to her, but the force calling to Rey doesn't mean she's a Skywalker.
     
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  18. SegNerd

    SegNerd Rebel General

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    One idea I have occasionally heard about, but never fully fleshed out, is supposedly Obi-Wan had a brother.

    I'm not sure if I want Rey to be a Kenobi - but if she is a Kenobi, she should be a niece or great niece.
     
  19. eeprom

    eeprom Force Sensitive

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    Originally, way back when, Obi-Wan and Luke's uncle Owen were supposed to be brothers.
     
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  20. DjChubakka

    DjChubakka Rebel Official

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    I've always felt the way that Rey talked about her family and the way it was danced around, they've been holding back who her family is. Maybe just to build suspense or anticipation or just to add mystery. I would not be surprised if there's is a "whoa..." reveal, I also don't have to have one. I'm ok if it never happens. I think that Obiwan having a child that then had Rey seems a bit... inelegant and disjointed.
     
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