Your post TLJ ranking of Star Wars movies

I disagree strongly. Let's just look at some popular prequel reviews on Youtube.

Jeremy Jahns: Episode 2

Pros: The Jedi fighting in the Arena was pretty cool.
Cons: Everything else.

Chris Stuckmann: Episode 1

Pros: Episode 1 Podracer is a good game.
Cons: Everything else.

Cinemassacre: Are the Prequels bad?

Episode 1: Bad
Episode 2: Average summer blockbuster
Episode 3: Good

And do I even need to bring up the Plinkett Reviews?

I'm sure you could find some reviews that say the Prequels are pretty good. I don't doubt that some people really enjoy the stories in these movies. But here are four large online critics with largely similar issues, and a lot of people vocally in agreement with them. So yes, it is unfair to say that overall everyone is in agreement that the story is great.

Because Practical Effects vs. CGI discussions largely miss the point of both of those disciplines. You don't replace one with the other. You use them to enhance each other. The reason why I like the effects in The Force Awakens so much is because they do an excellent job in blending the two together to create a near seamless effect. Most of the stuff close to the characters, or things they directly interact with, are practical, while the things in the background and various digital effects are all computer generated. Look at this scene from Attack of the Clones:



They aren't interacting with anything. They don't have CGI doubles fighting with the actors. They don't have any idea what they're doing out there. They are literally just standing around waving lightsabers, which will be 'fixed' by CGI. No, the issue with the Prequels and CGI isn't that it's overused, but that it's used incorrectly.

 

Oursourced, I don't really care about the two biggest and popular YouTube reviewers in the world, which are Stuckmann and Jahns. I stopped watching their reviews years ago after I realized how false Stuckmann is and how generic/boring Jahns is. And you are cherrypicking from their videos. Stuckmann liked ROTS, for example, but it doesn't really matter. And when it comes to Mr Plinkett, you do realize that he strongly dislikes The Last Jedi right?

I was mainly talking about reviews about TLJ posted by people who didn't like the movie, and then made comparisons to the prequels by saying that "they were bad but at least they had a good story and respected the lore". There are loads of those videos. And when it comes to the popular reviewers like Stuckmann and Jahns, you don't need to go far into their comment sections before you find popular comments explaining that they enjoyed the prequels. In fact, I find these comments very often, and they have increased since the release of TFA.

So you are just looking at one side of the spectrum.

And you did not just bring up the green screen thing? *facepalm*




Oh look, they're not interacting with anything....

Greenscreen is used a lot these days, and it was used a lot in the sequel trilogy. The reason why people post photos from the prequel sets was because they popularized the green screens on such a large scale. Now it's very common.

 

Yeah, and I like RotS a lot too. That's not my point. My point is that there is a significant portion of people that don't like at least some of the prequels, and judging by the likes to dislikes on all of the videos I posted, that portion is much larger than you seem to give it credit for.

And that's fine. I don't have a problem with people disliking TLJ. I know how divisive they are, and that it's largely a 50/50 split within the fandom when it comes to them.

Respected the lore? Maybe. But good story? No. I've seen a lot of the same comments. But where they're "Oh, TLJ is making the prequels look good", you seem to be reading far too much into them.

They're interacting with exactly what they need to interact with. The scene is shot almost entirely with closeups, and is supposed to be incredibly intimate. Like I said, the foreground is practical, the background is CGI.

The reason I post them is because they use it very poorly, and in places where it could easily be replaced with actual sets.

 

Oursourced, nope. I think you're missing the point and pulling too much of your own personal opinion into this, and cherrypicking certain comments to fit your argument. The overarching story is what binds together the prequels and the original trilogy, and this is something that even people like Stuckmann acknowledged. But again, its pointless to mention certain people since they also have a certain personal taste or motivation to please a specific type of viewer.

So you posted that gif because the greenscreen was used poorly? What do you expect them to fight against, actual droids? Besides I can post countless of photos from sets and models from the prequels. It's useless to have this discussion.

 

And you aren't equally biased towards the other side? I'll admit that i'm biased, but i'm trying my level best to bring evidence into this discussion.

So, what, i'm not allowed to bring up people who actually reviewed these movies because they might be biased about the movie? That is lunacy. Yes, reviewers can be biased for or against certain things. But so is everyone.

Stand-ins, because it's clear they have no idea what they're doing. I mean, look at that compared to these shots from the Maz Castle battle in The Force Awakens:





There is just more there. Each actor knows what they're doing, the context of the scene, who they're fighting, etc.

Feel free. I'd love to talk about them.

 

I don't disagree with much if anything here, I would just argue that using CGI improperly is overusing it.
If you don't know how to use it, use it minimally.
LOTR did this very well coming from the same era of filming

 

For starters, check out this thread: https://thecantina.starwarsnewsnet....sets-practical-effects-in-the-prequels.10150/

There were so many real sets in the prequels, and bluescreens were used in the OT as well. There were more models used for the prequels than for the OT, but that's not the point. There's really no point in trying to compare one thing to another, and try to say that one thing is better than the other. The point is that its ridiculous to complain about the prequels for this reason.

There's an even bigger one with hundreds of pages over at TheForce.net, but I'd rather not go on that website. But a quick google could educate one another.

 

Wait wait wait.

Is the argument you're trying to make... that it's pointless to say one thing is better than another thing?

Really?

 

I was talking about practical effects vs CGI in the context of filmmaking.

Let's try and be funny another day.

 

I'm not trying to be funny, and your derisive attitude in that regard is not helpful. I legitimately thought you meant as a whole.

Regardless, I've said several times my problem isn't with the use of CGI. My problem is with CGI being used incorrectly and to poor effect.

Yes, the Prequels did use sets. And some parts of the OT were on bluescreens. But that's not the point. My point is that quite a few scenes used CGI when it was detrimental to the film.

 

I completely agree with that. In fact, it is about film-making as a whole. About shooting, lightning, cinematography, artistic direction. If you are a bad director your CGI will just look ugly. No matter the amount of CGI or practical effects.

Also, I would like to add my list.

ESB
ANH
TLJ
ROTJ
TFA
ROTS
RO
AOTC
TPM

 

I agree with you on Fellowship and parcially on Towers. But.....I hope you don't count the King's cgi orgy

 

But it was really just once IMO.
And it didn't make the whole thing.

 

1ESB
2ROTS
3TFA
4TLJ
5ROTJ
6ANH
7AOTC
8TPM

 

1. ESB
2. ROTJ
3. ANH
4. RO
5. TFA
6. ROTS
7. TPM
8. TLJ
9. AOTC

 

Imo the more movies we get, the less meaning lists like these will have.
That being said, my favourite one will always be the original Star Wars (or ANH) because of its historical relevance.

 

Here is my list:

ROTJ
ESB
ANH
ROTS
TPM
AOTC
RO
TFA
TLJ

 

1) ROTS/ESB

3) ROTJ
4) AOTC
5) ANH
6) TPM
7) Rogue One
8) TLJ
9) TFA

 

Interesting, it's rare to see someone place AotC that high.

 

1. ESB
2. ANH
3. TLJ
4. TFA
5. ROTS
6. ROTJ
7. RO
8. TPM
9. AOTC