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SPECULATION "Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter."

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' started by Andrew Waples, Sep 5, 2018.

  1. Sparafucile

    Sparafucile Guest

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    I look at it this way, what had happened had the Jedi not gotten involved?

    Sideous being able to operate beneath their nose due to his trickery isn't their fault, it's a power they did not know was even possible or how to defend against. So had the Jedi not gotten involved, the clones would still have fought the droid army, the loss of life would have been greater without Jedi intervention. The Republic would have fallen sooner, and Sideous would still have been in charge, yet probably even more insulated and hidden behind Grievous or Dooku or Ventriss or whoever else. There would have been a figure head in charge, the Jedi would have been reviled by the people (Sideous would have made sure of that, spinning their non involvement to pressure them to get involved or eradicated by the people). In the end, without the Jedi knowing where or who their true enemy was, they did the best choice they could.

    Sideous's power and manipulation made it that the Jedi had no clean and simple solution. Unless you or someone else can tell me how the Jedi could have succeeded without knowing Sideous was the manipulator and Sith, I don't see a solution here. Their solution was in determining Sideous was the threat, but Sideous's power was specifically designed so they can't make that determination. To me, that equates to it not being their fault.
     
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  2. Adam812

    Adam812 Rebel General

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    • If Luke is now a purely luminous being, maybe we could see him demonstrate his power over crude matter. Perhaps the dark side counterfeit to a force ghost is a physical return from the dead. We could see Snoke return from the dead in physical form, a.k.a crude matter, to battle the luminous being that is Luke. Luke would then incinerate him once and for all. That might be cool
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 18, 2018, Original Post Date: Sep 18, 2018 ---
    Luke would argue that the light side of the force would have worked through other people to stop Palpatine.
     
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  3. Logray Ewok Medicine Man

    Logray Ewok Medicine Man Rebel Commander

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    While Kenobi and Yoda sometimes make it look easy for them to return from the netherworld of the Force, the saga has made it clear that this is something that is very difficult. Despite all of the powerful Jedi who lived prior to the Skywalker saga, Yoda seems to think it is a very monumental achievement in Episode III that Qui Gon was able to return from the netherworld of the Force. Kenobi and Yoda then apparently spent considerable time "communing" with Qui Gon in the years to come (as was depicted in Clone Wars). Kenobi was then able to communicate with Luke after his death, first just verbally, and eventually in visual form. At no point prior to Episode VIII was any deceased Jedi able to do anything more than just speak or appear to the living. This all changed when Yoda's force ghost made contact with Luke using his cane causing a (modest) physical reaction, and then sparking the bolt of lightning. Yoda may have achieved powers after life that no other Jedi has achieved. By moving Luke, and then sparking lightning, Yoda has demonstrated an extrordinary power, even for the standard of Star Wars. Whether Luke can achieve this power in death is a question I believe Episode IX will address (and may even answer with its title).

    I think its interesting that one of the original ideas for the ending of episode VI was to have the ghosts of Kenobi and Yoda shield Luke from the powers of the Emperor. It was rightfully rejected for a more compelling climax. From a narrative perspective, the idea of the deceased manipulating the world of the living can be problematic, as it makes the danger of death less compelling. Given Abrams' skill as a storyteller, I'm hopeful that he will use the idea carefully. Nevertheless, given the way Episode VIII teed up the idea that the deceased can physically interact with the world of the living, I anticipate we'll see that happening to a much greater extent in IX.
     
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