Where are the plot holes?

I absolutely get the value in what you’re saying. I was just pointing out that they already do a version of this. They do have people unaffiliated with the film review rough cuts and provide input. It’s a pretty standard part of the movie making process. They just don’t consist of ‘specialists’, but a sampling of likely audience members. The manufacturer does quality test them just like any other product going to market.

 

What is the temperature of a Wampa? How did it melt Luke's feet into the ceiling? Why didn't it kill him?

 

Wampa's breathe fire. Duh.

 

Hmm, I don’t remember that being in TLJ. I must have missed more than I thought.

Anyway, if you hold a wet shoe next to a block of ice long enough, it’ll eventually freeze in place. Did the Wampa really hold Luke upside down with his feet on the ceiling so long they froze there firmly enough to hold that much weight? Yeah, apparently so. Wampas are very specific diners it seems

 

Luke contemplating to kill Ben in his sleep. This goes against everything we know about Luke. Seems like that meets the pothole criteria

 

There's a lengthy list of plot lines dropped and other problems listed here:

 

Why lol. Isn't that what Luke was going to do. He even says that. If that's not inconsistent with what we know of Luke, what is then. This isn't the Luke from the original trilogy that I'm aware of

 

Welcome to the cantina!

I'm not so sure it's out of character. We know from previous movies Luke can be impetuous and makes mistakes. Plus he carries the moody skywalker gene, psychological baggage, and anger management issues.

It's hard to judge without knowing exactly what Luke was sensing in Kylo that shocked him so much. He's aware of the damage a dark skywalker can cause to the galaxy and his reaction may have been motivated by self preservation or protection of others - as wrong as it may have been.

 

Original post:

Luke didn't contemplate it. He reacted to the nightmare that he saw in Ben's head. It was an instinctive reaction and he let go of it almost as soon as it entered his mind. That doesn't go against everything we know about Luke. It just makes the point that he is human and still susceptible to human emotions - the Dark Side. Rejecting the Dark Side 30 years prior doesn't mean he is cured. It just means he knows how to reject it and so, him having this moment and then rejecting the idea is completely in keeping with Luke's character.

And even if it wasn't, even it if was a bit of a stretch (as I know it is to some), that still doesn't make it a plot hole. And that is why I originally responded with:

 

Yes it does make it inconsistent, because it goes against everything Luke is and represents. You can't have a drastic change in ones character, especially one who has already faced this challenge before and reacted completely different to it. Hell, Luke doesn't even raise his lightsabre to the emperor at the end of Return of the Jedi after he's defeated Darth. He throws it too the ground, because he's overcome his fear and anger.

 

You mean exactly like he did in The Last Jedi?

 

Fear is not something you overcome once and then it's gone forever. Imagine how nightmarish it must be for Luke when he feels the darkness in Ben Solo after he thought everything was over. He faced impossible odds and won against the dark side, and the OT gets it's happy ending. Years pass and everything is seemingly good. And then he senses it again, IN HIS OWN NEPHEW.

 

Once again showing how in consistent this film is.

 

Yes he threw the lightsaber away and overcame his fear and anger. But that doesn't mean that he is magically cured from dark side temptation for all future. "The force will be with you, always" and part of the force is the dark side, it never goes away. Most important is the fact that Luke resisted this pull to the dark side as well, he did not give in.

I'll let Lady Musashi's great post explain it further...

 

Once again Luke was beyond this at the end of return of the Jedi. On par with Yoda one could say. You think Yoda would have contemplated killing Ben on his sleep

 

Who said anything about raising his saber to The Emperor? It's Vader that gets him mad, Vader that he beats down using the Dark Side and then Vader he actually contemplates killing in anger and sealing his own turn to the Dark Side. He stands there for sometime, caught up in the Dark Side, close to murdering his father in anger. But he, eventually, rejects the thought when he sees what he is becoming. He acts rationally and throws down his saber.

In TLJ, we see Luke, obviously already deeply concerned about Ben, discovering the extent at which his soul has been corrupted. He sees the pain Ben will (and consequently did) cause and likely already has - and reacts emotionally, out of fear. The fear that is in all of us and that we will always be there. But thankfully, as we have seen, Luke knows how to reject the Dark Side - even when it is at its most forceful and persuasive. And being the Jedi pro that he is in this moment, he rejects it as soon as it entered his mind. Your "plot hole" would only make some degree of sense if Luke went into the hut looking to kill Ben and/or spent some serious time thinking about it and attempting to do it.

 

It is Luke's ontological conflict, helping friends and ruining everything (ESB/ training Ben) or throwing away the sabre and trusting the force (ROTJ/ Luke's exile). Luke hadn't really resolved that one, but did so at the end of TLJ by finding a way to combine the best of both.

So I don't agree.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 8, 2018, Original Post Date: Jan 8, 2018 ---

Yes, Yoda would. But actually doing it is something different. Obi Wan is more into killing brothers or students for that matter, on Yoda's orders of course.

 

It is a plot hole, because I could write anything and try to justify it. It's lazy writing at it's finest. Instead of creating a more layered story, Rian wrote one with built in excuses.

 

And Yoda was in on the plan to kill Anakin.