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Alien invasion,is this the shocking truth?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Last Jedi' started by McDiarmid, May 22, 2017.

  1. cawatrooper

    cawatrooper Dungeon Master

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    Actually, I'd make the GOT comparison in a slightly different way.

    Westeros has been plagued by internal conflict for seasons now, but the true threat is the White Walkers in the north. Much like how the aptly named "Star Wars" sees a galaxy constantly torn apart by war, while a greater threat might lurk outside the reaches of the known galaxy.

    The Thrawn stuff is great, because it's just vague enough to make this certainly a possibility, without having to commit to anything.

    If we do end up seeing anything like this, I have two thoughts-
    1) Snoke may indeed end up being a part of whatever threat is out there, but he is only a sort of vanguard.
    2) We won't see any more of this threat unless we get a second trilogy.


    After all, each conflict in the films has gotten progressively smaller. The Clone Wars was a huge conflict on both sides. The Galactic Civil War had a large Empire (though smaller than the Republic) fighting various Rebel cells, most notably the Rebel Alliance (all cells, even totaled together, still far smaller than the CIS). Finally, while the Resistance is roughly the size of the Rebel Alliance, the First Order is but a shade of the Galactic Empire.

    After years of war, it seems the dust is beginning to clear, with the last combatants remaining on the field. It might be cool to see the Resistance and First Order bring each other to their knees while Ren and Rey eventually defeat Snoke, only for the trilogy to end on an uncertain note as unknown legions begin pouring into a galaxy now crippled by war.
     
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  2. Protocol Droid

    Protocol Droid Rebel General

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    Yes, agreed about the Thrawn stuff being a deft touch that opens up possibilities (without committing to them), and with the concept you've posited here -- it could even be that Snoke was a failed or frustrated leader within the unknown regions (small fish big pond) who came to the known SW galaxy to rule, only to be followed by a much bigger power. It doesn't matter if they consciously used him or just waited for him to do what he does -- weaken everything.
     
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  3. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    The remnats of the Emperial forces ( First Order to become ) escaped in to Unknown Regions jumping from Jakku.
    Now that did not supposed to happen this way.

    Palpatine had those plans:

    1. If Galaxy rejects his rule , he will escape with the elite into Unknown Regions and there rebuild his"perfect" Empire. A superstar destroyer was already sent and parked and waiting for him in the Unknown Regions.

    2. If he dies,his empire goes down with him and last remnants are to be destroyed by settiing Jakku to explode with all of them.

    ----in our story we have third unexepected secanario.

    3. Palpatine died. Gallius Rax faild to execute his order (in case he dies) of blowing up Jakku and gathered forces there, and many of those Imperials jumped into Unknown Regions.
    They were never supposed to go out there without powerful Palpatine.
    In a way they came leaderless into Unknown Regions.

    Palpatine knew something "powerfull and dark" was waiting there. This entity(Snoke obviously) manipulated and hijacked leaderless Imperials out there.
     
    #63 McDiarmid, May 26, 2017
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  4. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    Snoke is, according to this artist reconstruction that has been made upon available data, dressed like some emperor from Ming dynasty.

    ....Or ,dare I say, " Vong "dynasty?:D

    [​IMG]
     
    #64 McDiarmid, May 27, 2017
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  5. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    In this recent artistic depiction of Snoke, according to latest available data, the artist realjburns made astonishing reconstruction of what to expect of Snoke's real look.
    Snoke doesn't look like some being that has been hiding, waiting for ages in the unknown Regions contemplating about Dark Side, waiting to be found, living ascetic humble lonely life.
    He wears golden-silk robe, he has big dark ring(probably Kyber) .
    He looks like aristrocrat, he obviously likes and expects luxury, like a king or even emperor, in fact like Supreme Overlord, monarch, head of the state.






    *please do note I am updating OP with this new material.
     
    #65 McDiarmid, May 27, 2017
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  6. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    You Know what I think?
    If this is true it will be the tuch of genius.
    And know why?
    Because Vong invasion almost destroyed Star Wars, it was, in fact hated by many of fans, galaxy left in ruins.
    Only a bold masterminds could make this come back, in the same time bring controversial story on agenda, using this to delete Vong race from memory by introducing another more "realistic" extragalactic race, and redeem it as a perfect story.
     
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  7. Pastor Barndog

    Pastor Barndog Force Attuned

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    I think Snoke may very well be from unknown regions. Even a never before seen species I just hate the idea of another galaxy in SW. Disney already stuck unexplored space right in the middle of the Galaxy with Ach-to.

    Thousands of worlds in the galaxy and plenty in the areas of wild space beyond the outer rim.

    I know I'm splitting hairs but another galaxy jumps out of SW. Like planes in Game of Thrones or vampires in James Bond.
     
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  8. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    In case Snoke is just from Unknown Regions there are few important problems.

    As we know unknown galaxy is just about 30-35% of the entire galaxy. And even good part of this this Unknown space is less hospitable for living, it has lower "quality" of habitability . Few species do live and lived there, but it is not just a wild west that was left uncharted, it is for a good part a Mordor of some kind, inhospitable on many places (unlike "left side" of the galaxy).

    Palpatine talks about:"labyrinth of solar storms, rogue magnetospheres, black holes, gravity wells, and things far stranger".

    Than, even if Snoke was from Unknown regions forever:

    What was such powerfull being doing there for millenia without his influence been detected?

    He is so powerfull, why was he hiding?

    He is so ambitious, again, why was he hiding?

    He can influence Ben while fetus in the womb of Lea from this same Unknown regions,...wow.. why was he inactive before, hiding?

    If he is so abitious and powerfull, and he is, even if he was hiding from the known galaxy how can he be alone there in Unknown regions, without creating his own empire there, and in such case how could this empire stay not detected, without contact with galacatic civilization? It will be agressive empire, seeking the ways to expand.

    If he was in some kind of hybernation, burried,in stazis, again how does he know everything about the Republic, and Empire?
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    By logic reduction I conclude (unles Story group has made another incredible story, or incredible mistake) Snoke is a leader of ancient civlilization that came from another galaxy.
    He simply was not present in this Galaxy before let say 50 or max 100 years ago.
    This race is weakened, weaker in umbers and resources than galactic civilization combined, and its scouting shown it was not strong enough to defeat the Empire, but was probing, scouting the galaxy for decades, and is methodically advancing. They waited, colecting data. After the defeat of the Empire, they found the moment has come.
    More so, a remnants of the Empire, shaken, and leaderless, came in their hands, and they needed a strong leader, a wise substitute for their Dead Emperor.
    They got one.

    Snoke is powerfull Dark sider, anlike anything we ever sough,from the old republic to the Sith, he is using the Force in way it has been developed separately in entire different galaxy, that is now destroyed.

    Palpatine did suspected something, he felt Snoke is calling him, but from Thrawn we also know Palpatine was informed about possible threat, so he was caucious.

    I do not rule possibility, considering distances and relativity of time and space, that galaxy encountered this aliens millenia ago, and this was maybe written in anceint books (like those Luke is searching for).
     
    #68 McDiarmid, May 28, 2017
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  9. Addi Ras

    Addi Ras MASTER TEA MAKER
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    This is where I think we disagree slightly for me Snoke & possibly his race come from the UR which is unexplored due to the difficulties in navigating it not that it is inhospitable to life after all the Chiss seem to be doing just fine there.
     
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  10. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    Could be, still , than Story group used in my opinion Unknown space as a "shelf for everything", while I think Snoke is to powerfull and to old , and to agressive to be undetected there despite "maze" that separated Known Regions from UR..Afteral he himself influences Ben as a baby from the other corner of the galaxy...?!

    Thrawn race lives in the "left Lower" corner of the galaxy that is not so roughly separated but was simply to distant, jet they became known to main galactic civilization , despite been relatively small and in fact reserved race.

    How about agressive race that threathened them?

    And Thrawn reports his race has been treathened . He literally asks Palpatine for help and mutual cooperation agains that threat.

    Thus I see those main problems with story that Snoke is from Unknown Regions:

    1. Space problem- not that massive space, and even something was known about it already, for this powerful being , and civilization , to be left undetected for millenia.

    2. Inactivity problem: Why was Snoke's race inactive jet so powerfull, and obviously so ambitious, agressive, he wants entire galaxy, why now, and he is ancient?

    3. Insight problem: If inactive before, even "hybernated", and awaken, why does Snoke knows everything that happened in the last 50 maybe 100 years.?

    My conclusion-- he (and his scouts) was physically not in the galaxy until relatively recently.
     
    #70 McDiarmid, May 28, 2017
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  11. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    I hope they don't consider them.
     
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  12. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    Snoke is so indiferent about First Order losses.They have lost Starkiller base and he seems to have calculated such loss in his strategy.What could be, I am asking myself, the resources left on his disposal to continue offensive on New Republic and Resistance?Even if First Order still has the Starfleet the size of that one which invaded Hoth in Empire Strikes Back,which is overstretch of imagination already considering resources available to First Order which btw.focused on massive now destroyed starkiller base ,even this is not enough to conquer Galaxy.I believe Snoke must have additional army waiting to strike.
     
    #72 McDiarmid, May 28, 2017
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  13. emphram

    emphram Rebel General

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    I never read the Vong books, what was it about the whole thing that people disliked?
     
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  14. LadyMusashi

    LadyMusashi Archwizard Woo-Woo-in-Chief
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    I know what Story Group dislikes about them. Somewhat like Ysalamiri, they were immune/invisible to the Force. (This is the reason why Ysalamiri are simply a species of lizards in the new canon.) That clashes with Lucas' (and therefore Story Group's) vision of the Force in which everything is part of the Force. Because they were immune, in Legends they represented great danger because Jedi could not effectively fight them.
     
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  15. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    The Yuuzhan Vong War is the centerpiece conflict of The New Jedi Order, a multi-author book series published by between 1999 and 2003. The war appears in the nineteen (19)novels, three e-Book novellas, and three short stories that make up the series.

    It is well elaborated massive reading material of Expandend universe (Now Legends), and it happens in 3rd decade after the fall of the Empire during the New Republic and Luke's rise of the new Jedi Order.

    They came from the other galaxy after that galaxy became almost inhabitable ( elaborated why, in short Vongs overdid it in their galaxy to), it happened millenia ago.

    After probing, scounting during the Empire,they strike weakend New Republic with devastating consequences.

    They were inteligent, physically strong, and had techology that manipulated with life. Their ships were living things, able to repare themselves like living body, for instance.They xenomorphed planets, changing them to suite themselves.

    Their leader was powerfull, Force user, Supreme Overlord.

    Using advanced biotechnology in every field of life, the Yuuzhan Vong were masters of adaptation and subterfuge, as well as brute force and terror tactics .

    Their xenomorphing destroyed all life on the planets in the galaxy they invaded since they were life from other Galaxy,

    -the Problem:

    The story, while been immense in its scope and power, in fact by opinion of some fans destroyed Star Wars galaxy, literally.
    By opinion of some fans Vong race was made to powerfull-it was not well balanced .
    They call themselves Chosen Race and believe the will of the Force is they must rule all others and kill almost everyone, and populate Universe themselves.

    In one moment, Chosen race defeats New Republic and Imperial remnants, penetrates in the Core Planets, including Coruscant.
    They xenomorph Core planets, including Coruscant which was genocyde. Only after inner civil war within Vongs and change of tactics of the remaining Galactic people (fighting for survival) and with the help of Luke and remaining New Jedi , Vong was defeated.

    Vong wars left galaxy with around.- 360 trillion dead sentient beings.

    Many fans (including me )believe it was to much as the Galaxy was nearly wiped out , Vong race was not balanced, made to powerfull, and scope of genocyde over thegalaxy have left stone in the stomach of many despite final victory.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    However ( my opinion), if made more balanced, Snoke's race could be extragalactic invader that are not that strong and not that much Superior and strange in technology numbers and tactics, and this, in my opinion will be great story.
    In the same time it will push Vong story into oblivion and redeem effort of people who made the original story.
     
    #75 McDiarmid, May 28, 2017
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  16. Fearghas_Ajax

    Fearghas_Ajax Force Sensitive

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    While I may be one of the few who liked the NJO series and would have liked to have seen them on film, I agree with others here that Snoke doesn't have to come from another galaxy to possess those qualities. There is a lot of unexplored areas, the unknown region, that would like to have many new, possibly "aggressive" races to pose a threat or a single individual that was banished from their world that suckered a group lost and looking for a leader and a direction.
     
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  17. Grand Master Galen Marek

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    We should see by the next trailer if Snoke's army shows up.
     
  18. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    I hope this will happen, if for no other reason then for possible logical conflicts to be resolved.
    For me ,personally , attack of the First Order starfleet the size of older Imperial fleets, however "stylish" , will be hard to comprehend and rise questions where did Imperial remnants got resources ,and manpower, for this.
    They already lost gargantuan project of Starkiller base which they built, and which will be burdeon even for the budget of the old Empire, and plus on this building massive strfleet, and division of stromtroopers.....where did came from, they don't have more than few million population on disposal, entire First Order. So I hope Story group have thought about logistical logic behind the First Order power, afteral he were abselnt for just onme generation, they could have not multily their numbers.
     
    #78 McDiarmid, May 29, 2017
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  19. Addi Ras

    Addi Ras MASTER TEA MAKER
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    Absolutely no chance of SNOKES additional army that is if he has one turning up in ESP VIII maybe towards the end of IX but not befor.

    I also like the new idea that he was keeping caked out by his own people & has now manipulated his way back to leading the FO as it's kind of a inverse of Thrawns arc.
     
  20. McDiarmid

    McDiarmid Force Sensitive

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    Maybe Snoke is not leader of some extragalactic race as I think, however there could be another similar possibility:

    Since Snoke is ancient and powerfull , and charismatic, (as we can see he put into submission Imperial remnants), he has put also into submission some exotic alien races in the unknown regions over the time, and he will strike with that "hordes" of this "vassals" as a second vawe, after the New Republic, Resistance and the First order exhaust themself enough.

    I will be very surprised, and dissapointed if the First Order is the only military force on disposal to Snoke. He was so cool and unimpressed by the fact Stakiller base was collapsing, which was major blow to his First Order. How about "Second Order" or more precisely second vawe?
     
    #80 McDiarmid, May 29, 2017
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