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SPECULATION Do Rey's Parents Matter?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' started by DailyPlunge, Apr 7, 2018.

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Do Rey's Parents Matter?

  1. No - Kylo Ren and the new Jedi Order are Rey's priorty

    51 vote(s)
    55.4%
  2. Yes - The key to Rey's future is in her past

    41 vote(s)
    44.6%
  1. Apprentice of the Wills

    Apprentice of the Wills Rebel Commander

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    She can be whomever she wants to be. That's what made Luke a successful character in the OT. What also made him successful is the amount of internal and external conflict he had to overcome to get there. Her relationship with her biological family doesn't have to be her entirety, but it is a part of who she is and how she views the world. Her relationship between her family and her identity defined her when we met her, and a successful arc for her would be Rey either coming to terms with it in a healthy way to empower her or by having that destroy her. We have one more movie to go for her character so there is a strong chance we see something try to derail or accelerate her rise/fall based on that internal conflict.
     
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  2. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    And her biological family is no one important...TO US. They obviously matter to her but their being of importance beyond that was always a fan concoction.
    The conflicts you are describing, is Kylo Ren's ACTUAL conflict.
    So I think there lies the crux of conflict....
     
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  3. Apprentice of the Wills

    Apprentice of the Wills Rebel Commander

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    They are parallel characters. Their conflicts and arcs are narratively linked.
     
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  4. Jedi MD

    Jedi MD Jedi Commander

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    Correct they are parallel characters but there is a duality with them. Rey is from a unimportant lineage and had a crappy life. She has every reason to be bitter, angry, and resentful. Instead she is hopeful, good and of pure morals. Kylo on the other hand came from SW royalty. He was the son and nephew of the galaxy’s greatess heroes. He should be the one who is hopefull, good and of pure morals. Instead he is the one who is bitter, angry, and resentful.

    This is why Rey being from a non special lineage is so powerful and why she does not need to be a Skywalker or other special lineage. You even said that Kylo and Rey are the central characters and as @RoyleRancor has pointed out Kylo is the legacy character of the trilogy
     
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  5. RoyleRancor

    RoyleRancor Car'a'Carn

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    Exactly.
     
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  6. Apprentice of the Wills

    Apprentice of the Wills Rebel Commander

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    I agree with that. The disagreement some are having with me seems to be about the semantics of prompt of this thread. I don't care if her family is special. I'm just saying that they are important to her as a character and to her development as a character. They matter to her so they matter to the story. Due to the parallel storylines that we all agree exist, they matter as much as Ben's famous parents and uncle matter. It makes sense for her evolution as a character (based on the precedent in the franchise) for her to learn something in the next chapter about her family that gives her new insight into her understanding of herself. It doesn't have to be that she is related to anyone important or that she is an heir to anything, but it does need to put another obstacle in front of her so that she can learn and grow through her final confrontation with Kylo. Ben/Kylo will face the same thing leading up to it, too.
     
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  7. Trev

    Trev Rebel Official

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    For a long time, I believed her parents did matter — but once they were revealed to be nobodies in The Last Jedi, I realized it made perfect sense.

    Rey parallels Kylo in the sense that she came from nothing and amounted to something good, while he came from everything and amounted to something bad. Much like Luke, who she is as a character extends beyond her heritage. No one liked Luke for being a Skywalker, but rather, because he was a hero that we could relate to and someone that the audience empathized with. The fact that he was Darth Vader’s son didn’t matter at all in A New Hope, and it wasn’t until the end of The Empire Strikes Back — after audiences already were invested in the character — that his parentage was even revealed. (Some people didn’t even believe it until Return of the Jedi.)

    The point is that Luke wasn’t defined by his parentage, and Rey won’t be either. The hard thing with Rey is that fans had this preconceived notion she had to be either Luke or Leia’s daughter going into this trilogy. But much like Rey, we also had to come to terms with the realization that she isn’t Luke or Leia’s daughter. She isn’t a Solo or a Skywalker, she isn’t the daughter of anyone we already care about. She’s a great character on her own. One of her challenges has been rising above this idea that she has to be related to someone important to be important herself.

    I think the sequels have made it evident that Rey doesn’t need to be a Skywalker to have a place in the story, and out of all the new characters, she’s the most obvious representation of the Original Trilogy heroes passing the torch to the new guys.

    So, yes, her parents matter to her and therefore matter in regard to her story arc. But they don’t make a difference in terms of whether or not Rey matters. Who she is and what she represents is far greater than her parents, and overcoming the idea that she was defined by her parentage has been one of the challenges of her narrative so far. I’m excited to see where they take this concept in Episode IX.
     
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  8. Apprentice of the Wills

    Apprentice of the Wills Rebel Commander

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    I appreciate you writing this because it seems that you read most of what I have been saying in our recent discussions. I feel like what I was saying about Luke choosing his own destiny by controlling his relationship to his biological and chosen family in ROTJ fits well with your third paragraph. That's the arc that I see for one of if not both of our central characters in IX. She doesn't need to be a Skywalker. I never understood why people wanted her to be a Palpatine or Kenobi or whatever.

    I agree with what you said here: "overcoming the idea that she was defined by her parentage has been one of the challenges of her narrative so far". That is her greatest inner struggle and that fits so well with the rest of the saga. I, too, am eagerly awaiting what happens next.
     
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  9. Trev

    Trev Rebel Official

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    Great minds think alike, my friend. :) This is exactly how I feel. Her being related to someone we all know would be a twist, for sure, but it’s also predictable and an easy way out. Rian Johnson knew what he was doing when he made her parents nobodies in The Last Jedi — he knew it was impossible to top the “I am your father” reveal, so he didn’t. Even though some people might have been underwhelmed, it was necessary for Rey’s character arc. A lot of people have an issue with her being a nobody, but I like it and would argue that it allows her greatness to extend beyond just being a Skywalker. She’s found her place in the Skywalker family even if she isn’t related to them by blood. I think that’ll tie into her relationship with Kylo quite a bit going into Episode IX, so it should be interesting!
     
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  10. Jedi MD

    Jedi MD Jedi Commander

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    I agree with this. I have made this same point previously. While to everyone else her parents are not important, they are important to Rey.
     
  11. Rellum

    Rellum Rebelscum

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    I personally care very little who her parents are and if there is anything that was worth giving some care too is I prefer her not to be a skywalker. I want the force to be more a galaxy wide phenomenon not a skywalker one.

    If her whole story is trying to find her family only to realize at the end of the ST that resistanc is her real family I will be very underwhelmed.
     
  12. Pawek_13

    Pawek_13 Jedi General

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    I was recently thinking about Bloodline and Rian Johnson's input and what if his input wasn't bits of lore but something more thematic instead? This whole book is anout how Leia becomes an enemy in the eyes of the public opinion solely because she shares half of a genome with Vader and the main antagonist of the story is a lady that is obsessed with genealogy and hereditary titles. In other words, this novel is a dig at SW fandom's obsession with bloodlines and how it works to the detriment of the heroes of these stories. Just something to think about during the Christmas break.
     
    #332 Pawek_13, Dec 27, 2018
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  13. FotisKaragian

    FotisKaragian Rebel General

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    It matters and it doesnt at the same time. It can only add depth to Rey's backstory, but since it is highly unlikely to be the offspring of a major character, it adds nothing to the overall plot.

    If they regret the "Rey nobody" scenario and try to change it now, it will require a lot of caution to not make thing even messier...
     
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  14. ThisIsNoCave

    ThisIsNoCave Rebelscum

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    I think that the subject of Rey's parents will continue to be an issue despite what Kylo Ren told Rey following the fight with the Praetorian guards in the throne room. Dialogue from one of their Force connections lends something to this:

    REY: Why did you... Why did you kill him? I don't understand.
    KYLO REN: No? Your parents threw you away like garbage.
    REY: They didn't!
    KYLO REN: They did. But you can't stop needing them. It's your greatest weakness. Looking for them everywhere.... in Han Solo.... now in Skywalker. Did he tell you what happened that night?
    REY: Yes.


    This is classic manipulation at work. And Kylo Ren even tells Rey that. Previous Dark side Force users have manipulated those from whom they wanted something - Sidious/Palpatine, Dooku, Vader - by appealing to their emotional neediness. In the case of Palpatine he exploited Anakin's desire to keep Padme safe. Dooku attempted to appeal to Obi-Wan's respect for Qui-Gon Jinn. And Vader attempted to turn Luke in TESB and ROTJ.

    So when Kylo Ren and Rey have this exchange...

    REY: Ben! The fleet. Order them to stop firing. There's still time to save the fleet. Ben?
    KYLO REN: It's time to let old things die. Snoke, Skywalker. The Sith, the Jedi, the Rebels.... let it all die. Rey. I want you to join me. We can rule together and bring a new order to the galaxy.
    REY: Don't do this, Ben. Please don't go this way.
    KYLO REN: No, no. You're still holding on! Let go! Do you wanna know the truth about your parents? Or have you always known? And you've just hidden it away. You know the truth. Say it. Say it.
    REY: They were nobody.
    KYLO REN: They were filthy junk traders who sold you off for drinking money. They're dead in a paupers' grave in the Jakku desert. You have no place in this story. You come from nothing. You're nothing. But not to me. Join me. Please.


    It's clearly because Kylo Ren believes that he has eroded that shred of hope that Rey had about her parents. They were not there for her, but he can be what she needs. Again, classic manipulation. But Rey resisted this advance and defied Kylo Ren.

    Where does that leave Rey's story now? It's going to be interesting to see. I personally think that there may be some link between Rey and some characters that we have known before. As far back as TFA there were hints that Kylo Ren knew something about Rey. His line "What girl?" to Lt. Mitaka in TFA indicated some sort of knowledge.
     
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  15. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Coramoor

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    Here's the problem... every one of these theories requires mental gymnastics to explain and essentially Star Wars is easy to understand. Rey being a nobody has always been there from the very beginning. It was reinforced in TLJ. Kylo Ren is the entitled rich boy who has famous relatives. Rey is the complete opposite. She's a poor nobody. This whole story is about the two opposites wrestling for control of the galaxy. This story is going forward and spending more time on Rey's DNA just seems like a waste of time at this point.
     
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  16. ThisIsNoCave

    ThisIsNoCave Rebelscum

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    Characterizing the established methods of manipulation by a Sith or dark side user as "mental gymnastics" simply doesn't take into account what we have seen before, time and again. Kylo Ren was manipulating Rey's need for her parents and attempting to fill that vacuum in her life. Whether that storyline pays off in some way shape or form is yet to be seen. But him regarding her as "Nothing. You come from nothing" is him trying to exercise power over her, while his motivations in seeking her out in TFA indicate that he knows more about her than he has ever truly let on. He actively sought her out following her escape from Jakku, he appeared to her in her Force vision (when she had never encountered him before) and he actively sought her out on Takodana without EVER having seen her before. JJ Abrams laid the groundwork for something that will pay off in Episode 9. If not in her parents, certainly in Rey's origins.
     
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  17. DailyPlunge

    DailyPlunge Coramoor

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    It's been said over and over that Rey was a nobody. Not only from Rey, but the entire narrative is that Rey is not going to find what she's looking for looking backwards. That's in TFA and that's from Maz.

    Rey turns to the dark side on the island in order to look back. It offered her something she wanted. That's what scared Luke. I guess after Empire people argued about whether Vader was lying to Luke. The simple answer here is the answer.
     
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  18. Apprentice of the Wills

    Apprentice of the Wills Rebel Commander

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    YES! Thank you! I was wondering how many other people saw this the same way I did. Also the extremely coy and knowing look Maz gives Han when she asks, "Who's the girl?" when Rey heads down to the basement where she finds Anakin's lightsaber. And even the look that Luke gave her at the end of TFA had loads of subtext that we did not see in the continuation of that same scene in TLJ. It just feels like characters know more than they are coming out and saying, and they are putting the pieces together to discover whatever the truth may be.

    Her arc and Ben/Kylo's arc alone make this an interesting story that still has life in IX regardless of what happens with our supporting cast.

    These lines tell me that this is just as much of a struggle for him as it is for her. He is absolutely manipulating her in this scene but he is also channeling his disillusionment with his family in the process. He feels betrayed by his family and so wants to control her through how her family let her down, too. They weren't there for her when she needed them, the same way his family wasn't there for him when he needed their support and love. His solution is to cast everything away and to destroy the things that hurt him and who remind him of that pain and disappointment. He wants to hurt the people that hurt him. I completely agree with your use of the word "hope" to describe her relationship with her family. She has a constant, blind, and naive hope that they will return to her. This gets her into trouble but is also her redeeming quality. This hope is always why she believes that she can save Ben and that he is willing to change. She falls for that trap but learns from the crushing reality of her mistake. I think this will influence her approach to others in IX so that she isn't as blindly naive as she was in the previous films. She may come back as more composed and centered like ROTJ Luke with purpose and conviction. I'm looking forward to seeing what challenge arises to shake her conviction.
     
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  19. Xeven

    Xeven Rebel Official

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    I can live with Rey, nobody. What I want is Luke to have fathered twins as well. Even if he was not aware.
     
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  20. Pawek_13

    Pawek_13 Jedi General

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    Why do some people want Luke to have sex so badly?
     
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