Is Ben Redeemable?

while we have hope.. anything is possible

^ proof that anything is possible.. he never agrees with me just like that

 

I agree,
The only thing we know about Ben's childhood is that he was a child of neglectful parents and that he began training as a Jedi when he was already a adolescent.
There was already a dark influence in Ben's life even before he was born, even Leia sensed it.

So untill we know the whole story, I,ll reserve judgement about Ben's fate.
Maybe he's possesed by the evil spirit of Palpy for all we know.

 

I agree with this point - there can't just be an easy out for Kylo Ren at this point. What would ruin the story was if he experienced a professional wrestling style face turn.

Vader's turn back to the light never made much sense to me. He murdered countless people, but saving his own son is somehow supposed to make up for that? Yes, he turned on the Emperor, but moments before that the Emperor was trying to get Luke to kill him. That's not exactly selfless.

It's not that I object to the concept of redemption for Anakin, but as it was portrayed, it was very easy. And while I accept it because of it's narrative importance, I would hate to see it repeated. If Ben Solo is to be redeemed, it should not be a quick fix. Nor should it come without appropriate consequence.

Vader's consequence was the sacrifice of his own life. But it seems that most of the people hoping for Ben's redemption are wanting it so that he can wind up in a romantic relationship with Rey, carry on the Skywalker bloodline, or both. But for Kylo to get a simplistic happy ending would undermine what is, at its core, a morality play. It would also be emotionally hollow.

 

No. This saga is about killing off the Skywalkers.

 

Ben / Kylo are the same person so no not really, its all the same to me. I'd rather save Jar Jar. Let the Skywalkers be, they have suffered enough. Let the bloodline go, if we let it go now, we don't have to put up with the same rubbish ten years or so down the line. Time heals = acceptance prolonging the agony will just make for pissed of folks. We only have to look the TLJ. I'd rather not have that again.

 

Yeah probably, but I would prefer not. I like my bad guys who commit.

 

People are pissed because they killed a Skywalker off.

Yeah... let's not do that again.




#KyloMustDie

#SoBenChewbaccaOrganaSkywalkerSoloCanRiseFromTheAshes

Skywalker is dead. Long live Skywalker.

 

Who is left for Ben to be redeemed to? He'll never be redeemed to the whole galaxy.
His father, uncle and mother are all deceased (unless they recast Leia).

I think the final look from Rey and shutting the door kind of shuts the door on her being open to Ben's redemption now.

I think something drastic would have to occur in 9 for Ben to be redeemed at this point.

 

We know literally nothing about the Galaxy. Nor do we know how much the Galaxy knows about Kylo Ren. I doubt they're going to have scenes with a war tribunal or wtv. Darth Vader couldn't survive without his mask, Ben Solo can.

Yep. She's disappointed. He'll have to do all the heavy lifting now. His redemption can't be the journey of a single choice but of a conscious attempt to change.

 

And if he goes into hiding, he still won't be redeemed to the galaxy.
He blew up 3 planets and tried to do more. No single sane minded person says "you had a bad day. it's okay. we forgive you." after that.

He won't be redeemed to the average person.
It would have to be on an intimate level.

That's what made the Darth Vader redemption work. He was redeemed to his son and daughter.

I can't think of a single thing he could do that would redeem him to the rest of the galaxy.

 

I agree - and there is a story to be developed there. He was groomed by Snoke to the dark side. Luke gave him his final push. In Snoke's throne room after the fight, you can see he has a warped view of the "right" thing to do, but he is trying to do right. With the rebellion almost crushed, no Supreme Leader dripping poison, and no evil uncle to kill left to motivate him, he may continue down this path of trying to do what is right, ignoring the past. It could lead to a place less in keeping with the first order. Of course, it could also lead to him being the ultimate evil, more powerful than even the granddad he idolises.

 

I doubt the average person's opinion matters in the SW universe. We never really hear it so nobody besides the hardcore fans even consider it. So it really wouldn't matter if he became a space vagrant.

I don't know how it's going to go, tbh. That's not for me to worry about. But I believe he's more redeemable now than after TFA.

 

Of course it "doesn't matter" to the narrative of the films but it matters to the overall sense of redemption.
If Vader survived DS2, he would have been in all likelihood a captive the rest of his life, or executed for his war crimes.

They've touched on how even years after ROTJ the galaxy hadn't still gotten over Vader and it's why it was used against Leia.
If true evil in the sense of Ren and Vader can be redeemed to everyone, is there even a point in having good vs evil?
What makes the Vader redemption work is who redeems him and why.

I already said he could be a space vagrant but that's still not redemption...that's just being a vagrant.

Personally, I'd leave Ren evil at the end of this trilogy so you can long form build for his redemption in the next years down the road. Give him a family of his own. So he can have a child/wife who can play into his redemption.

 

I don't think they'll leave EpiIX open-ended like that.

Besides, have you tried getting a gal to marry you whilst also sharing a force-bond with another female force-user who you've been previously/presently romantically attracted to?

It's HARD.

 

Sigh.
Have a good one.

 

And he doesn't have to be redeemed to the galaxy. Star Wars is about family and friends. It's enough when he's seen as redeemed in the eyes of his closest encounters (Rey etc.). If Rey can forgive him, so will Finn, Poe and the audience. And that's all what matters.

Yes, he may have to live in exile (with or without his new/old friends) but time can heal a lot of stuff. After a short or long period of time people will forget about Kylo Ren and the FO. But maybe that's not even necessary. We don't know how much is known about Kylo Ren in the galaxy. Maybe no one knows Ben Solo is Kylo Ren.

But in the end I'm opened for everything: a redeemed Ben Solo, an evil Kylo Ren, a dead Kylo or Ben. Just let the story flow in the right direction.

 

But can Rey? That's the whole point.
After what Kylo has done to her and the ones who tried to love her.....can she...
Despite fan theories, she isn't in love with him...but even then, she's never KNOWN Ben Solo...only Kylo Ren and what Snoke wanted her to see of Ben.
And that feels like it'd have A LOT of leg work to do in one movie to make that come full circle.

Ben's redemption has to be intimate and short of recasting Leia, I don't see any intimate redemption on the horizon without it feeling rushed given what we already know*

*know as in know, not fan theory.

 

Yes, she can. She closed the door on Kylo Ren, but not Ben Solo. She will accept Ben Solo as soon as he starts fighting against Kylo Ren.

I think she has seen Ben (the real Ben) while they were touching hands. Yes, Snoke may have been pulling the strings, but you can't fake or manipulate feelings. At least that's what I'm thinking.

Would you say Darth Vader's redemption was rushed? Think about it. The redemption started in the second half of the final movie. Kylo Ren's redemption aready started at the end of the first movie.

 

But Ben Solo can only come from Kylo Ren.

Yes you can. People do all the time. If Snoke showed her something that was false then those feelings and emotions are also false.

No but Luke was his son. That gives them the leg up. The bond between father and son. And Luke was willing to throw it away when Vader threatened Leia.
They have to explain WHY Rey would be so ferocious in her attempts at redeeming Ben now. She tried - failed. Why would she go back to that well so soon?
Ren's redemption wasn't started it was pushed away. He killed his father. That's the opposite of redemption.

 

Yes, the bond between father and son is strong. But the bond between lovers (or by the force connected people) may be even stronger.

Didn't you read the novelization of TFA? Killing Han had the exact opposite effect on Kylo than expected. He was further driven to the light.

He denied the redemption the first time (TFA). The second time he also denied it. But all good things go by threes.

#SaveBenSolo