SPECULATION Imbalance and Awakening in the Force

hmmm checkmate. Good interpretation. The Jedi even distrust the report that the Sith have returned, being "extinct for more than a thousand years". But then Lucas would say...."the Republic's mismanagement of trade routes and their usurpation by powerful NGO commercial enterprises has seriously thrown the force out of balance"

 

Not at all.

Like I said, it isn't just Sith that can cause imbalance. It's any person or group that uses the Dark Side (not even necessarily Force users - just evil people that are capable of impacting the entire galaxy) to spread evil across the galaxy. So to the Jedi, the Sith could be extinct and imbalance could exist.

Alongside this, the Jedi Council discuss the mysterious warrior who attacked Qui Gon and during that suggest that it couldn't be a Sith. This shows that they acknowledge that Dark Side users can exist and not be Sith.

My thoughts are that the Jedi aren't all that concerned about the prophesy of the chosen one until it becomes clear that the Sith have returned (do they actually believe the Force is moving out of balance in TPM before the Sith are revealed?).
They then see that perhaps the prophesy will be true in its entirety - that the Force will be put out of balance and a chosen one will restore it. They then conclude that the prophesy actually refers to the destruction of the new Sith threat.

My point is that in TPM the balance has at best only really started to slide. It goes further and further out of balance during the events of the PT. So up to that point (TPM - before Sith reveal), the Force might either be slightly out of balance or not at all (noticeable) AND that the prophesy at this point is still just a prediction that the Jedi believe may not come into fruition at all.

 

Wait haven't the Jedi been around for 1,000 by the time of TPM ? Have the Sith have been extinct for as long as the Jedi order has been in place ? I'd love to see a force sensitive Cato memoirist !

 

Firstly, I would suggest that the prophesy was seen as just that, a prediction about the future that may or may not be accurate.
The prophesy itself spoke of a time where darkness would reign - but this might have not been occurring or at least felt by the Jedi by TPM.
OR they did notice an imbalance but put it down to something other than the Sith - but they were confident, overly so, in their ability to handle it.
In both AOTC and ROTS the prophesy is shown to be doubted by leading Jedi. They certainly doubt the Chosen One.

Does the prophesy refer to one who would alone restore balance - yes and I think that's how the Jedi read.
How he would restore balance is not known - but in the PT it is presumed that it means he would destroy the Sith and that is proven to be correct.

 

His exact words are "You refer to the prophesy of the one who will bring balance to the Force".
The use of the word "prophesy" is key. A prophesy is a prediction, given a bit more weight by being from a FS person mind. But a prediction nevertheless.
This prophesy was clearly one of the more prominent ones, however I am not certain that the Jedi knew it would come true (in the Force going out of balance and/or a chosen one restoring it).
But like I say - yes, there might have been an imbalance felt. The Jedi could've felt the balance at this point and before being out of balance. In fact, some (Qui Gon) probably felt it more than others.
But your original question was how could this be the case if they didn't believe the Sith etc existed.
My answer is that the Force can be put out of balance by any group or person who is influential/powerful enough to spread darkness across the galaxy.

You were right in thinking that. When Anakin destroyed the Sith, he destroyed the two individuals who were spreading evil across the galaxy (and took down the Empire). This destroyed their influence and thus the Forces of evil were no longer more powerful than the forces of good in the galaxy. They balanced out again.

 

They've been THOUGHT to be extinct....the Sith have been biding their time, and now that their plans for galaxy-wide domination are coming to fruition, the Force has created Anakin to stop them.

 

In talking about in relation to heir perception .

 

Well, in terms of sensing the most powerful Dark Side user, they didn't even notice Sidious standing right in front of them.

 

He did hide for years...what if Sidious had actually been around for a thousand years and just hid his signature ?

 

I was in a debate about this recently and up to that point I hadn't given it thought beyond the idea of the Sith as only being the ones who cause imbalance.
My original view was that only a Sith (or someone in a Dark Side order that has the same access to that kind of power) could do enough to disrupt the balance.
However, upon deeper thought, I think anyone can imbalance the Force if they are able to spread enough evil across the galaxy.

The important thing to remember is that "The Force is an energy field created by all living things".
From what I can see, the imbalance is very much about how these living things are impacted by those with power.
Before I go into this I should also explain that the energy that is the Force both consists of energy that has been and energy that is in the present being created.
Anyway, when there is a powerful evil Force in the galaxy spreading darkness, or as Maz and LST say "Shadows" and "Despair", the fine balance between good and evil is disrupted. It can't be said enough that good and evil will always exist together. People have the propensity for both, at all times, within them. And so balance, is good and evil in equal measure.

But what people like the Sith do is tip the scales towards evil. They spread evil (hatred, aggression, corruption, greed) themselves and force others to do so.
With this being the case, when the darkness is stronger than the light - those who are evil are creating "bad" energy and those who are the victims are too as they are full of fear and they are suffering. It's a vicious circle and all this negative energy is what in part creates the Force. So that's why there is an imbalance - the bad energy dominates the good.

And this is where the Jedi come in. Without them, the Forces of evil, usually beings who can command the Dark Side, run riot.
It is possible that a non Force sensitive could destroy them but it is very unlikely due to the awesome power they possess - both in the physical sense but also the mystical side of things - seeing the future, influencing the weak minded etc. This is also why it is possible but unlikely that a non-Force sensitive being or group could cause imbalance themselves. Without that extra hand by the powerful Dark Siders, these evil doers will essentially not have an advantage over the Force of good.

This is why LST says that without the Jedi there cannot be balance. Only Luke and a Jedi Order have the abilities to destroy the KoR and enable the Resistance to have a chance against the First Order. Once they do this, there will be balance again.

 

I guess.... I know a lot of EU has been tossed out, but I'm pretty sure Palpatine grew up on Naboo, so people would have known him for most of his life there.

 

Yeah it's as if each planet has their own people ONLY being elected to places of high power .

 

Okay..... I'm not sure where you're going with this...

 

But my point is Snoke or whoever doesn't impact upon the balance by just being a Sith or KOR or whatever (by name). They only impact upon the balance if they are actively doing something. And I don't think Snoke actually does anything to any great extent until after ROTJ. My opinion is that he is someone like Plagueis who had been badly injured and living in exile. Then balance is restored and he decided to emerge at this point. He takes over the FO and KOR and then starts to spread evil and despair thus pushing the Force out of balance again.

 

Ok, the whole force balance thing does not make sense. Apparently the force thinks 10k + Jedi = 2 Sith for 1000 years is balance. But, you have 2 dark side users (Snoke and Ren) and only 1 light side user (Skywalker) the force loses its damn mind and starts calling to Rey. It is a bit logically inconsistent in the movies.