SPECULATION Knights of Ren Hierarchy

Good. I defiantly believe and hope that the other knights of ren are not force sensitive.
As for where they are in TFA, i'm pretty sure they're with Snoke, protecting him. This would back up the fact that Snoke is the "grand master wizard" of the KOR

 

where does that leave Kylo Ren? Master of the Knights but with no one to actually master?

what strikes me in the way the film plays out at the moment is that it doesn't suggest that there are acolytes at all. it's almost treated like an extinct thing. sorta like Lord of the Sith in ANH where there weren't any Sith to actually Lord over (or with), even though it was still Darth Vader's title.

 

I interpet it like this. Kylo is the Master of the Knights of Ren, because he is Kylo "Ren". Snoke is also Kylo's master.

The knights serve Kylo and Snoke, but in situations like battle, Kylo is the one out there commanding them, not Snoke.
Kinda like the situation with Saruman and Sauron. Saruman's the one controlling the army and obeying/conveying the will of the Eye.

Yeah they could be extinct, but i hope not. I wanna see them for real in episode 8

 

i'd like to see them too!

note: Kylo Ren never calls Snoke "Master" (which would be the Sithy thing to do if that's where they were going with this). he always calls him "Supreme Leader".

maybe that has very little to do with the price of rice, but i thought i would throw it out there. i feel like there's a deliberate obfuscation of the power hierarchy in terms of titles and whatnot. it's all very vague.

 

Perhaps the KOR do still exist, and are with Snoke as his protectors. Kylo has been sent on a special mission to retrieve the map to Luke, and that is why is not with them in TFA.

 

Good idea. Since we are going back to the old days of doing things force users should be few and far between. Besides if you look closely in Rey's vision, one of the Knights of Ren is wearing Mandalorian armor.

 

I see this thread is full of heathens and misers who jealously guard the use of the Force so I must valiantly sally forth to offer an opposing view. (That first part was just joking around............mostly)

I can't remember where I read it but I believe that Kylo joined the Knights of Ren not founded them and that he adopted the name Kylo Ren upon joining the pre-existing organisation. I assumed that Kylo is their master because he his either Snoke's favourite or the most gifted member of the Knights of Ren. And yes I do believe/hope that the Knights of Ren are also force sensitive and have been training under Snoke all this time or off doing their own thing during TFA.

This is a great opportunity to introduce a dark side order that isn't limited to the rule of two Sith nonsense, that some seem to want the Jedi to adopt, and it makes them much more of a threat to our heroes if they are dark side warriors. You also have to consider the potential behind their characters if they are force sensitive especially if some of them prove to be ex-pupils of Luke's, a popular theory, rather than simply being more jauntily dressed lackeys or the ST edition of the Red Guard.

 

my only concern with FS Knights is some horror repeat of the AOTC arena scene. i understand the desire to be miserly about the Force. too much of it spread all over thins the mystique and has the potential to devolve into Avengers VIII: Ultron's Return of the Revenge.

if this is the direction the KOR goes, i just hope it's handled well. the precedence of the PT just makes me nervous.

 

Snoke refers to Kylo as master of the KOR as if it actually means something. If the other KOR aren't force sensitive then bring their master doesn't mean all that much.

 

Then Ren might all be separated and may be in various regions of the SW universe. Obviously, the events of TFA most likely didn't involves the use for the KOR. It seems that Snoke is going to be teaching Kyko for the moment. I would guess that if Kylo needs the Ren then he will assemble them.

 

as someone previously suggested the title almost sounds honorary in a sense to begin with. and giving Kylo Ren a buncha nobodies to Lord over sounds like exactly something Snoke would do.

i'm not saying i prefer this interpretation or want to see it happen ~ just throwing out the possibility that 1.) the KOR is a gang of hoods tasked with some specific agenda that doesn't necessarily require FSs but gives Kylo Ren something to cut his teeth on. and 2.) they may not even exist anymore given we never seen them except in that vision and neither Ren nor Snoke mention them aside from Snoke saying the title.

conversely, Kylo Ren may be the last of the Ren, the survivor of the Rens, which is why the title holds actual meaning. Snoke specifically uses it in reference to overcoming challenges. whatever the KOR is or was, it possibly saw some difficult action prior to the events of TFA, which might have even led to its near extinction.

crazy idea: for all we know Luke dispatched them himself. FS or no, it would give Ren that extra oomph for chasing Luke down and it would also fit Snoke's parallel in terms of challenges.

 

I think this leads credence that Snoke is not a Sith but another type of dark sided. Also, it has been a few weeks since I last saw the movie but I believe Kylo when referring to Snoke leaves off the supreme and calls him "Leader Snoke". I noticed it especially when he is talking to Hux.

 

That's even worse though:

Kylo Ren, Master of KOR - who were all ordinary people and now dead. Snoke refers to the title that it means something as Kylo is about to face his greatest test. I also think we need to meet the KOR to understand what they're about.

 

i completely agree. to me the key is in the challenge line. but that can be interpreted a number of ways. we simply don't have enough information to extrapolate.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 31, 2016, Original Post Date: Jan 31, 2016 ---

i actually think Hux refers to him as Leader Snoke too. so it's probably just general shorthand. but Ren definitely calls him "Supreme Leader" to his face.

 

I´m afraid they have no backstory at all!(yet). Wee will see what johnson will come up with...

 

What was specifically wrong with the AOTC arena scene? I don't think it was a great scene by any means but I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say you don't want a repeat of it.

As to keeping the force users to a minimum, it seems to be a ridiculous fear for maintaining the "specialness" of force users which is particularly jarring considering the numerous discussions over Finn's potential for force sensitivity where the pros are reassured that having FS doesn't make a good character or isn't necessary for relevance.

If the KoR were just a bunch of hoodlums then why would they be titled the Knights of Ren, that title seems to have connotations to the only other, or at least the most famous, organisation which used it, Jedi Knights. They could all be dead but unless we are told otherwise it seems more likely that they are alive, if fact I would think the burden of proof would be on those assuming they are dead. I'm also pretty sure that Snoke would have called Kylo the "Last of the Knights of Ren" rather than what he did call him "Master of the Knights of Ren".

I don't know, I feel like you're reaching with this one as apposed to your normal astute interpretations.

Yes, I've seen this theory before, I believe it implied that the KoR saw Ben as the new messiah or some such which is not entirely unfeasible but still more of a stretch than assuming they are Kylo's force sensitive comrades.

 

a bunch of hoodlums?

 

i picked the AOTC scene because it's the most visual one that comes to mind regarding the geneal problem i perceive in the PT: tons of Jedi fight tons of whatevers. i do like the specialness of the Jedi and feel like the PT watered all that down for me. i prefer a galaxy of mysteries as we were presented in the OT.

i'm not following you on the Finn thing. can you clarify how that figures in?

sorry, i don't mean to actually reach for anything. i was just throwing out possibilities since we have so little information. i have no pony in the race for the KOR. i'm happy to see them emerge as whatever, FS or not. my OP was not well worded.