Should Disney erase PT from canon?

Ur are so dishonesty, I hope u don't treet ppl in real the world like this?? U like my first post, I thank u, u then alter too pessimistic. Wtf?? Ok back too Prequels.

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HAHAHAHAA, witticisms galore bravo too u Astro my frend.

 

just please PM me. I feel that there is some sort of disconnect with language that we can jus talk it over with. .

 

This! Becuz the PT came second in the cannon and if they shooted it out, it wud bring out OT too. Everything all is connected just st as Georgia meant it too.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 16, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 16, 2017 ---

Ok ok English is not good sometimes. I forgive and forget. Thank u back to the prequels.

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Georgia oh, this autocratic. I mean George.

 

I don't think anyone is confused by the PT. They just acknowledge they aren't good

 

SW movies have always had bunches of things that were left hanging in the movies and this has always been the case and had nothing to do with bad storytelling. Sure, PT bashers will always find reasons to say the PT was bad but what I do find funny is that most of these people are extremely nitpicky when it comes to the PT but when you mention TFA they ALWAYS find ways to try to justify the HORRIBLE bad story telling in that movie. TFA was really bad in this aspect and the movie has tons of things that make no sense yet prequel bashers tend to ignore this and just bash away.

It was bad storytelling that Lucas invented midichlorians and we have to hate him for messing with the Force but JJ Abrams was a genius for how he messed with the Force with Rey? TFA didn't have useless dialogue or characters that were unoriginal and meaningless? Did it even have a good original plot or did it rip off one that was already done before? Comparing it to any single PT movie of your choosing, what new interesting thing did TFA add to the SW mythos that is better than said prequel movie?

 

The PT was the result of bad filmmaking, not bad writing. Edited better, acted better, better script are things that needed to happen. (Not to deny that there are PT bashers that hate the story of the PT and want to erase it from canon, that's ridiculous - shout out to the mod that editted this thread's poll BTW). The mythology was fine (except for the midichlorians, which has been retconned a bit by Pablo & Filoni in interviews such that most fans should relax on that point). The politics was fine but a bit boring and slow.

TFA works because of filmmaking rather than its writing, which is a simple enough hero's journey without much of a twist. We want to see Daisy Ridley, Boyega and Oscar Issac again. Nobody wanted to see Hayden Christensen and Natalie Portman in the same scene ever again.

 

I think the mythology in PT was a little problematic.

 

I voted: "do it already!"

 

For the most part sure, but there were egregious errors in the PT.

I do not think it is nitpicking to call out the consistently bad acting throughout.
Consistently poor pacing and editing.
Consistent ineffective dialogue.

And as for bad characters, none of the other movies had one run through 3 movies like a freight train reminding you how bad they are every 10 minutes.

TFA isn't bad story telling though. It's not a finished story.
As a finished story, the PT is bad story telling.

How did he mess with the force with Rey? As far as I can tell, he didn't make up something new for the Force that had never been seen.
Every movie has useless dialogue. It's called banter. Tarentino made a career of it. Problem is, Lucas used TOO much of it.

It's been explained that it doesn't rip off the plot of ANH as much people want to say. It's a movie about finding Luke Skywalker. The Starkiller base really serves as nothing but window dressing for what could otherwise be seen as a boring "let's go on an adventure to find Luke" movie. In ANH the Death Star IS the plot. Every action the heroes make in the movie is about stopping the Death Star.


You can't, in the same paragraph, claim that Abrams changed the Force but then added nothing new to the story....that's now how a debate works...unless you are a politician.

 

I have to defer on this my good friend because while I did want to see Padme and Anakin again, I really don't care for many characters except maybe Rey. This in my part has nothing to do with hating TFA but it's just that the characters didn't quite do it for me. The characters in TFA seem to be made with the sole purpose of being sweet and likeable and nothing more. Anakin and Padme were more complex characters that one moment you hated them and another you loved them and felt for them but can I really say the same thing about Finn who was just a Jar Jar type funny character? For all their flaws, Anakin and Padme were unique and were their own characters but those in TFA are just cool super charming people that can be just anybody. Look at this and think about when we first met Han and Lando. Both characters had moments were you hated them and wanted them to die but then as the story was developed you cared for them. Anakin was a self centered jerk most of the time but I sometimes wonder if people realize that his story was that of a villain and not a hero.

Padme and Anakin were supposed to be real messed up as this would eventually lead to his fall. Look at all the bad choices made by both characters and then you can perfectly understand why Vader turned out the way he did. That for me is a well made tale but now we have a guy like Kylo Ren who had two of the most awesome parents ever, two incredible uncles (Luke and Chewie) and the dude just wants to be Vader? Based on what? Just because that's cool? Just because a deformed J-walking alien came and told him to be like his evil uncle? Anakin had issues ever since he was a little boy being the precocious obsessive little twerp he was but what justifies the motivations behind a character like Kylo? And yeah I know that when you mention this as bad story telling, most people say that we haven't seen the rest of the movies but the funny thing is that the next movies are going to move forward and not backwards. Sure they may have a little dialogue here and there and Kylo may cry to Luke that he preferred the creepy two headed announcer as a student more than him who was family but would that really justify the actions of the jerk that killed Han just cause he wants to be bad?

 

I don't think that saying TFA isn't a finished story justifies how bad it's story really was. For me it was also a carbon based copy of ANH. On what you mentioned about Amanaman claiming Abrams changed the Force but didn't add anything new I have to say that I too think that Amanaman is right. Look at midichlorians, in what way do they alter the Force as we knew it in the OT? In nothing. They don't contradict anything. The Force still flows around the galaxy binding everything. The thing that midichlorians do is give people a good example of why you can use the Force and I can't. It gives a better understanding of why I can't be Force sensitive if I just choose to believe in the Force like Chirrut Imwe did in RO. Rey on the other hand disregarded what both trilogies showed us. You just don't learn Force powers out of thin air as Rey did. One moment she didn't believe that the Force was real and the next she's pulling mind tricks like a pro and besting a Dark Jedi that was trained by Luke Skywalker? That really is bad storytelling in my eyes as well. Abrams didn't add a new element to the story but just disregarded what we all knew just for the fun of making a new movie. That's not adding something that expands on what we already knew like what Lucas did with the midichlorians but ruining what the six movies thought us about masters and apprentices.

 

Yay, another bias thread where all the op wants to do is generate unnecessary drama/ conflict that's been done a million times before .

 

As for something

It wasn't bad story telling though. It isn't finished. If you don't grasp that, then of course you won't like the story.

Not a carbon copy. Who are Luke, Han, Ben and Leia trying to find for the duration of the movie? Which bad character turns good and saves someone from prison?
It takes elements of ANH and reworks them to put the focus on something else. That is not a carbon copy.

Midichlorians do not give us a good example of anything other than it's just about luck. And it directly contradicts that the Force is about belief and willingness to let it flow through you.

Midichlorians didn't add as much as you are giving them credit for. They were a fairly bad mcguffin by Lucas to cheaply explain why Anakin was so special. Why is Anakin so special? Midichlorians!

Jedi were seen as monkish and die-hard believers in the force. Now with midichlorians you realize they are just a bunch of select genetic winners. There's no real belief involved in the force which kinda conflicts with much of their teachings. You either have or you do not. No real in between.

 

The movie was indeed a carbon copy of ANH and you have to desperately WANT to like the story if you can't see this. On the whole Midichlorian thing, I have to ask, have you ever read the EU novels? When Luke was trying to rebuild the Jedi order, he used machines to find out who was Force sensitive and who wasn't. Now let's take both theories and see what makes more sense. You want me to believe the Force works by belief and willingness to let it flow through you right? Well what did Han tell Finn about this? That's not the way the Force works! No matter how much you believe (again take Chirrut Imwe as an example) no matter how much faith you have in the Force, you don't become Force sensitive period. How then can belief matter? Did the machines Luke used in the EU to search for Force sensitives detect the belief level of said individuals? Of course not. Admiral Ackbar can't choose to believe in the Force and it will lend him it's powers and let him become a Jedi in the very same way that Bib Fortuna can't choose to have faith in the Force to become a Sith. So that being said, then there has to be something inside you that makes the difference right? There has to be something inside the Skywalker BLOODline that's different from Ackbar's, Bib Fortuna's and Chirrut Imwe's which makes the Force respond to Luke's family but doesn't respomd to those others.

Now if you were to say that Luke's EU machines checked blood type for Midichlorians, then that would make more sense than having them track faith. It's a proven fact that not everyone can use the Force even if they have faith in it. Chewie always knew the Force was real and he was even friends with one of the most powerful Jedi masters that ever was and this didn't make him Force sensitive.

 

Well I guess that's why there's no real villain stories. There was no pity for Anakin, and there was little pity for Padme. Both characters spouted off horrendous dialogue with laughably bad performances. Either write them and act them well, or just write the novel.

Yes, the characters in TFA are likeable.

Kylo Ren kills his father, which is a mythological act of Oedipus. In fact, making me think about reveals something even more interesting about the character. He wants to follow in the maternal grandfather's footsteps, rejecting his own father in the process. This is very Oedipal - embracing the mother and rejection of the father. Thanks for making the character even more interesting!!!

And to further your reasoning, Rey is the one who was stuck in the past, and makes the decision to move forward as her abilities are revealed to her - an incredible allegory for Star Wars in general - indicated further by Luke's dialogue in the trailer "you have that power too" - its getting more meta by the second! Kylo is the one continually referring to his past, from the first scene saying that he couldn't escape his family, to maintaining his hatred for his father, who he perceives as weak and inferior while his grandfather's legacy is that of strength and dominance. Vader is a complete wish-fulfillment character - anonymous power that makes law on his own whim without any judge or jury. Who wouldn't want to be him? Sounds petty, but so is Kylo Ren. It works even better now that you've made me think about it! God I love Star Wars!

 

I do not desperately want it to be different, it is different. I have explained to you why it isn't the same and your only response was "Yes it is."
I am not arguing that it isn't similar and doesn't share classic Star Wars tropes, it does. In fact, I even said so.

Okay.
So does Jabba have incredibly high midichlorians or absolutely no midichlorians?
If he has high midichlorians, high enough to resist Luke's mind trick, why doesn't he use the force?
If he has none, why is he able to resist the superiority of Luke's mind trick on a lesser being?

Chirrut was clearly in tune with the Force, enough to make it to the switch unscathed. The force guided him there.

In the end, to me, it comes down to the entire fact that they are completely unnecessary to the story. Midichlorians explain nothing and create new questions no one really wanted. The Force was always better left being a mysterious...force. Lucas builds the PT on mythology but removes the best piece of mythology from the movies by making into Scientology. (Thetans are counts inside the body that determine your ability to rise through the ranks of Scientology...wait a minute...)

 

LOL why is this even a thing? And it's to late to do that now!

 

Blasphemy!!!

 

Here is what I claim:

An observable rise in criticism. Noted by observational evidence. I will go find comments from a negative review and cite the evidence just for you:

Username - Bryanzerator - Youtube comment "I used to like this movie... Then I saw this"

Username Dai 大 Youtube comment "Now I see why the dislikes, this review is on point and shows how truely sh#t this movie is."

Username Jordan Wartell Youtube comment "MIND BLOWN! I watched the entire video and couldn't believe that the hundreds of points he made were flaws so fundamental to the movie rather than CinemaSins just ranting about minor errors in one shot. Although I disagree with about one quarter of the stuff in here, I've never found myself so enthralled with a criticism for an entire hour. May this video receive 10 million views!!"

And there are many other examples. This is all from the source that I will cite:

As I said, observational evidence that cannot be refuted, FACT a growing rise in criticism.

I also desperately await a witty reply and find your "trolling" rating of my post clearly shows you are in denial.

 

I honestly have no desire to ever interact with you again based on this simple, MIND BOGGLING, inaccurate and downright of questionable intelligence post.
I would again easily refute your bogus claims, but you aren't going to either understand or engage in rational discussion over them.
I'm gonna throw you on the ignore list. Have a good one.