Should Kylo Ren be Redeemed?

First post ever here... thanks for the space to post, admins; thanks for reading, everyone else.

I'm very torn on the redemption of Kylo Ren, and, honestly, I'm not sure how I will feel about it totally until more details are known. I think there are two things I need to have answered before I can stand behind one absolute or another, which both relate to Ren's belief for doing what he does:

1) The events with Kylo at the temple (especially if the speculation of Rey being there and Kylo's saving her - I find this very compelling, and a further catalyst for the internal division of loyalties for Kylo). I'm also interested in his motivations for his attack of the temple (and more broadly his crusade), which I will delve into a bit more below.

2) Further explanation of Kylo's response to Rey, "You mean the traitors, murderers, and thieves you call friends?" - specifically was there more than Snoke and a disposition to the darkside that caused him to turn, and if so, will there any skeletons hiding in the Resistance's, Luke's, Leia's, etc. closet that led to his turning? It may be a simple throw away line, but I felt like there was a lot we weren't told, and after the fourth viewing of the movie I'm convinced that this line is more than the cloudy judgement of Kylo.

The reason this line originally sparked my interest is Adam Driver's comparison of Ren to a religious fanatic. Driver says "When they think of their actions as morally justified, it makes them dangerous and unpredictable,' Driver told Empire. 'There’s no level they won’t go to to accomplish what they’re after. I never thought of the character as an evil person." There seems to be more than lineage and power that drives Ren and I'm interested to find out exactly what it is. If he truly believes what he is doing is justified and if his campaign with Snoke is not just doing it for selfish reasons, I think a Kylo Ren redemption is not entirely out of the picture -- but only if his belief in his 'holy' crusade is shattered. Now what this moral reasoning/belief in his cause definitively is still remains a bit unclear. His line to Vadar's helmet "I will finish what you started" is still rather ambiguous (at least for me, feel free to weigh in) and it can lead us to speculate us a variety of things. But at this point so much of the background for this movie is ambiguous. I think that ambiguity leaves room for a redemption that could be done more naturally and believably than Anakin's because I think a moral belief in a cause that one believe is some type of holy, moral crusade is a more believable reason for turning to the darkside than wanting to save one person because you had a scary dream about them dying.

But like I said, I'm not making my mind for whether or not it should happen until more background is provided. However, do I think it could happen and that it could be done well at this point? Yes.

 

I keep telling to all my friends, we will see the full extent of what JJ and Kasdan accomplished with this script after the sequels come out. I'm certain my overall impression of the film will evolve with time.

 

I was recently watching ROTJ again (as a reassurance of happier times lol) and this dialogue is quite interesting:

Darth Vader: So, you have a twin sister. Your feelings have now betrayed her, too. (...) If you will not turn to the Dark Side... then perhaps she will...

Luke: [igniting light saber, screams] NEVER!

The bitter-sweet thing is that by reading the "Vader Down" comic series, there is one point where Leia faces Vader in the planet Vrogas Vas (between ANH and ESB) and she defies the Dark Lord of the Sith by standing true to her disposition of never giving in to the Dark Side (though her Force-sensitivity heritage still unbeknowst to her). So she would not turn to the Dark Side. But her offspring will.

 

Hey, thanks a lot. Like I said I've been reading post here for years but never took the time to actually join. I just could resist anymore. I'm 34 and have never not known Star Wars. As a young girl I would pretend I was Leia. TFA has awakened the Star Wars mega fan in me again.

 

Well I think he can Trevor he can follow his idol Vader, Redemption Equals Death no way he should live anything short of life imprisonment is a farce and I think he needs the death penalty for Order 66, Patricide, and has a high ranking official of the First Order a host of other crimes

 

Not sure I want redemption. He will be mustache twirling bad guy like Vader in the next film I think.

 

Rehab? After all his murders and crimes hell no...he shouldnt get a free pass just because he is a Prince. Vader works fine because he dies the Force absolving Anakin is all grand but it doesnt help all the people he murdered.

 

Again sure his family is fine but what about everyone else, he killed Luke's Academy, Slaughtered a Village and props up a regime that just nuked a solar system and conscripts children to fight in wars not really forgivable he can give his advice as a Force Ghost.

 

He is the Half-Blood Prince of Alderaan. Lol. (See? He's Snape!)

 

Lol that is good. Who is James Potter?

 

Good question. Maybe Poe Dameron?

Half-Blood: son of a non-Force sensitive father and a Force-sensitive mother.
Prince: since his mother was a Prince(ss)

 

Redeemed...Unredeemed...and in whose eyes? I don't know yet.

I will say that despite Harrison's masterful performance of a guilt-ridden father confronting past mistakes...I am still empathetic to Kylo.

It is my opinion that before the events of the film, Kylo has suffered a deep personal betrayal, a Trauma.

This, partially but not entirely combined by a quest for power to Control his destiny and his wounded heart has turned him to wrath, and vengeance.

His Oedipal execution of his father was not the product of power hungry hubris, but of pain...IMHO

 

this for me.. is the very heart of this conversation.

what did his grandfather start? or more importantly.. what does Kylo think his grandfather started?

the immediate reaction is to think that he wants to be as kick-ass bad as Vader.. but is that what Vader started?
perhaps.. and this is with a universal sized piece of salt.. he is referring to his grandfather bringing balance to the force?

i personally cannot pick one of the thread options - as i don't feel i know who Ben/Kylo is yet. i need more.. he's one hell of a complicated character from what we've seen so far.

we shall watch kylo's career with great interest

 

I'm really not sure how you redeem him without him dying and without it feeling like bull. Dude was complicit in the murders of billions of folks. That's not something that having good intentions or suddenly realizing you were in the wrong can really wipe away if you don't die in the process of your redemption.

 

It isn't the best explination, but it'll do for now. Lazy writing and weird editing I suppose.
http://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2016/01/the-droid-awakens-r2-d2s-sudden-awakening-explained.html
As for Maz and that saber, am I mistaken or isn't this yet another glitch in the film? After all, Luke's saber which was originally Anakins, was chopped off with his hand in ESB. Then Vader admired the construction of Luke's new saber in ROTJ. Vader's saber was then lost in the final scenes where Luke in turn chopped off daddy's hand. So the only saber that could now be Rey's, is Luke's, not Vader's.
Wait, haven't we had this discussion already?
As for Phasma and the planets destroyed, I'm sure they'll answer that in the next movies.

As for Kylo, I think it would be an interesting thing to watch if he has a slow awakening to the truth of how blasted up the Dark Side and it's allies really are. And at the same time to watch Rey fall down that path like a rumbling stone down a mountain. Yeah, some of this has been done before obviously, but if done right it never really gets old. It shows how vulnerable we all are to the inner "forces" of good and evil. Everyone needs to be reminded of that now and then. Even me and my Atheist friends.

Of course I also agree that it would be fantastic if he just stayed horribly wicked and destroyed everything and everyone he came into contact with. Because like some have said, there's nothing better than a superior villain who has absolutely no redeeming qualities. And it's even more fun when they get their comeuppance. Although like others have stated, we have some pretty great villains here already. Hux is unbelievably Hitler-esque, and Snoke has amazing potential to be even more despicable than the late great Palpatine. Sooo...maybe we should cut gullible Mr.Ren some slack. Haha

Of course it would be a real hoot if Snoke doesn't end up being as horrible as we are led to believe and it's actually Luke who prevails over all. But that's for another kooky post.

 

Anakin chopped children into chimichanga and people ok with it. So logically it'll be hypocritical to not accept Kylo.
But Han is not children -) We'll see. I don't know.

 

I would support him being redeemed, granted it's done well.

For most of us, I think it would be more emotionally impactful. We saw Anakin redeemed, but most of us jumped into it when he was already bad and he mostly just killed other Imperials, in all honesty. Even with RotS, we see him killing the younglings, but at the same time it doesn't really impact us because they were no-names we had no connection to. Even Obi-Wan we only got to know years/decades after first meeting him.

But Kylo... Ben... he killed Han Solo... a definite emotional attachment for us. A redemption for him -- again, if it is done well and makes sense -- would potentially give us an impact to at least match the original redemption of Anakin.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 7, 2016, Original Post Date: Jan 7, 2016 ---

Yes, hate to admit it but no-name younglings just don't have the same impact.

And man now I could really go for a chimichanga.