Snoke/Kylo story about Rey parents does not hold.

Do it with actual context clues though. There is nothing in this film that even remotely hints at her being a Skywalker and Snoke expecting the awakening was another Skywalker other than Luke. It makes zero sense when then just told you she was a nobody. They are trying to show that nobodies can be somebody, which is why they show a poor slave stable boy using the force to grab a broom. It’s all there.

 

Even the story group doesn't know at this point, most likely. They'll decide in IX on whether or not Kylo was lying to Rey.

 

Look it's pretty clear we have different opinions, this is a discussion forum and speculation is what many of us like to do. If you are not interested don't do it but I'm not going to stop just because you don't like it, you can ignore this thread if it does't make sense to you.

 

Vader had a son and he never knew it. He had a force sensitive daughter and didnt know it till after he fought Luke.

I assumed Snoke knew a hidden skywalker would appear and be the awakening.

I assumed all this until i came across this thread. Hence i dont think ive over thought this.

Before Ren turns to the dark side, theres two equally opposing forces...Luke the Master Jedi v Snoke the Master Dark being.

If Ren turns...and is turored by his new Dark Master...the one thing Ren is going to be reminded is...that naturally your Light user opposite is going to appear...hence this awakening that finally happens cannot be Luke. Cos Luke is already there in the equation.

I could be wrong.

 

Actually the folks in this thread are trying to say THEY DO KNOW that Rey is a Skywalker because they are incorrectly interpreting Snokes comment “Darkness rises and light to meet it. Skywalker I assumed, wrongly”. If this is the evidence then I can only shake my head.

 

And thats also the definitive proof that Rey is a Random. She cant be connected to the Skywalker line.

Cos Snoke admits hes got it wrong. And that evil chuckle is RJ's haha chuckle at all of us who sat here for the last 2 years thinking Rey was a Skywalker. Its RJ's way of saying "i got you!".

I thought it was a fantastic Movie. Simply cos its evoked so much emotion and debate inside myself and around us. It got people worked up. It got them to think out of the box. To get "invested". Its not a movie you watch and just never think about again.

I havent been able to snap out of it.

I dont like everything in TLJ. But why would i...its not my movie or my vision. Why should every form of art be cattered to my needs and desire.

 

Exactly, even if he said “A Skywalker I assumed, wrongly” he would be telling us I THOUGH YOUD BE RELATED TO LUKE BUT I WAS WRONG.

So what people are saying is...

Snoke was wrong about being wrong.

Snoke meant “a Skywalker” , not “Skywalker as in Luke, even though he’s referred to Luke as Skywalker multiple times and never meant his offspring.

Kylo is lying to Rey.

Rey is lying to herself.

Luke had children that nobody in the galaxy knows about.

Holy crap, I just figured it out. Luke had a son after he disappeared and went looking for the 1st Jedi Temple. It’s the stable boy that force pulled the broom! He awoken! He’s about the right age that Kylo wouldn’t have met him because it was after he went to Snoke. That’s why he looks to the stars, just like his dad!!!

 

Techsteve...

Im not gonna speak about what others believe or hold to be true...

I intrepeted these two movies as...

Snoke feels an awakening. As equal in strenght to Ren.

Snoke knows its not Luke. As both Snoke and Ren would be able to recognise Luke in the Force.

Snoke assumed the awakening is a skywalker who they have never encountered or heard of or know off...

Snoke admits his mistake that Rey is the awakening and hence not a Skywalker.

We know for sure Rey is not a Skywalker.

Thats my logical progression.

Why would Snoke remind Ren about the Luke factor being the awakening when they already know about his potential danger...and have the whole empire out looking for Luke. They wanna eliminate Luke cos hes Luke and always gonna be a thorn in their side.

The reason Snoke is concerned about the awakening is cos its something Snoke hasnt factored in. I.E an unknown entity.

 

Can you point to one thing Snoke says or does that tells you this?

Let’s start with “Snoke knows it’s not Luke”. How can you say that when he specifically says “Skywalker I assumed, wrongly”. What tells you that Snoke knew it wouldn’t be Luke? Wasn’t that the point of finding Luke and killing him, TO PREVENT the Jedi to rise again?

You also say they could recognize Luke in the force. How do you know this? Nothing in the film tells you this.

P.S. -The entire film of the Force Awakens was about Rey. Not some unknown Skywalker that has yet to be introduced.

 

But why would Snoke be so afraid for this awakening when they already know of Lukes potential danger to their Kingdom?

They have the whole empire looking for Luke to eliminate the Jedi Order for good.

Luke being the Awakening in Snokes mind isnt Logical. Luke is already a known Quantity. Hes already there!

Im looking at the glass half full. You are looking at it half empty. I cant ask you for definitive proofs...cos we wouldnt be having this conversation if there was.

Its my intrepetation versus yours.

If Snoke or Ren couldnt recognise Luke in the Force then how does Rey know Luke is "gone". Rey knows Lukes status in the force but Snoke and Ren cant?

Is it not linguistically possible that Snoke meant "a skywalker"...maybe Snoke thought the only one who could compete with Rens genetic force is a fellow Skywalker.

Yeh it was about Rey. But so many of us thought she would be a Skywalker. Snoke got it wrong. So did we.

I truly believe shes a Random. But if someone wants to carry on holding onto a hope that shes
a Skywalker...then why would i care?

 

Because they think he's back. He's been gone for many years. His presence in the force is gone too because he cut himself off.

They are looking for him because he's the "seed of the Jedi order" that Snoke speaks about in TLJ. He's the only one that can bring back hope. Kill Luke, kill hope.

Again, Luke hasn't been there. All of a sudden there's this awakening. Snoke and Kylo react like anyone would, "oh crap, Luke is back". Remember Snoke was also worried about "the new Jedi will rise". That's why there is this mad dash to get to the map to Luke, they have to put out the fire before he can spark hope by training new Jedi.

I'm giving you actual proof from the films based on what they have said, you've just given me guesses.

It's actually not because the dialog is very clear.

Yes. Rey is connected to the light. But even if Kylo could feel Luke gone as well, it's too late now.

When you add Snoke's comments after he mind probes Rey it makes it even more clear. He says "well well, I didn't expect Skywalker to be so wise. We will give him and the Jedi Order the death he desires". Snoke has the Awakened Rey right in front of him and knows that all he has to do is kill Rey and then wipe out Ahch-To. Then nothing can stop him.

 

Well, my belief is that Snoke knew something about Rey, but, sure as hell didn't want Rey or Kylo knowing. So he planted the vision in Kylo's head, hoping he'd tell Rey to get her to come to them. It's a bit of an altered theme of the trap that Vader sets for Luke in torturing Han and Leia, knowing Luke would sense it thru the Force. Snoke uses the force to plant the trap in Kylo's head that gets Rey to come to them.

Snoke knowing the possible truth of Rey is potentially why he wanted her dead on the spot. Keeping the truth of any kind of family relationship away from Kylo only benefits Snoke because he sees Kylo is still twisted about his parents.

There are still some clues within TLJ that hint at the possibility of lies. First is as others have said, Rey's vision is of a transport taking off. Junk traders on Jakku wouldn't be leaving on a transport. There's nothing to suggest Rey's Force vision would lie to her in this instance.

Another hint is that at least once (possibly twice) we see Luke connect with Leia via the Force and immediately after that Rey connects with Kylo. The one time I remember for sure is the first time Luke opens himself back up to the Force and connects with the comatose Leia. Right after that Rey connects with Kylo. I believe there was a second time this happens in the movie but not sure about that. I believe this is a hint as we see the close bond between brother and sister being shared through the Force as Luke contacts Leia than immediately it goes into a Rey/Kylo connection.

The end scene of the little boy with the broom shows that the future of the Jedi Order was out there, waiting to be trained. That Luke's story, the legend of Luke Skywalker's sacrifice at the Battle Of Crait was spreading.

This idea that The Force is being returned to the nobody's is just so mind numbing. It makes me wonder if people actually watched the movies. The Jedi Order survived for thousands of generations without Skywalkers. That's thousands of generations of nobody's. Obi Wan was a nobody in ANH. Yoda was a nobody in ESB. Luke, by his own admission took on a dozen or so students to start his own Jedi Order. I bet they weren't all Skywalkers.

The end scene doesn't show us that the Force has been returned to anything. It simply shows us that what Luke said to Kylo was true, Kylo was wrong in believing Luke was the Last Jedi.

 

J.J. Abrams could RESTORE the story he was trying to tell. But if Rian Johnson believes Kylo Ren was telling the truth, then he was the one who changed Rey's story. And if Rey is NOT a Skywalker, then what is the point of this particular trilogy being a part of the Skywalker family saga?

 

This is the story of how the Skywalker saga ended and passed on their strengths and failures to the next generation of Jedi and leaders. Seems pretty clear this was the intention of the writers all along. Ben Solo and Rey Nobody are what this trilogy are about.

 

Pretty much.

For true fans to be satisfied, they would need to ditch the movie format as a medium for these films and give it to us in seasons like with Game of Thrones.

There just isn't enough time onscreen to properly flesh out these ideas or these characters. Yes even at 2.5 In fact, 2.5 is nowhere near enough. Nowhere near.

Imo, half the film could have been just the Island with Luke and Rey. We needed so much more of that, as an example.

 

This is a bantha poodoo answer. If the protagonists of this trilogy are not Skywalkers, then there is no good reason for this trilogy to be a part of the Skywalker saga. Period. This is how Disney is handling the end of the Skywalkers' story? By having the members of the family as supporting characters or a villain? Screw this! No wonder I have been disenchanted with Disney's handling of the saga. If Abrams doesn't fix this mess, I'll focus my attention on the six films made by Lucas and pretend that this trilogy doesn't exist.

Oh, and I noticed how you kept poor Finn out of the mix as being a major focus in this trilogy. In other words, he doesn't really count, because he has the wrong skin color.

 

Your answer reeks of your own desires and bias. Rey isn’t a Skywalker. Get over it.

And Finn is just another example of a nobody becoming a somebody. Another example of how heroes can come from anywhere, not just from the sacred Skywalker bloodline. Your desires for bloodline heroes prove just how much you honor royalty over heart.

 

The poll is weirder THAN Luke drinking green milk
But THEN again, my answer will be ...

 

You know, I've wondered why Kathleen Kennedy and Co. are so insistent that this trilogy is a Skywalker family trilogy. Really? If Rey is the daughter of two random losers, then we are down to one member of the Skywalker line and he is the bad guy who may not be redeemed until death. If they want to push new ideas and new characters, fine, but stop running your mouth about this being all about the Skywalkers. I also agree about JJ changing Rey's story. With one stroke of a pen, he could make her whoever he wants. That's not me wishing or hoping, because I don't care much at this point about what happens in Ep. 9, but he has the power to change Rey's backstory...again.

 

What else would you call this saga? It's the final three films with any Skywalker's left?

JJ won't change Rey's backstory because it would serve zero purpose. If he made her a Skywalker or Solo, then her and Ben just had a romantic bond with a cousin/sister. Do you really think they are doing in the incest angle again? If she's a Palpatine or Kenobi then we have MASSIVE timeline and backstory holes to fill in and ZERO impact on the story they are telling. Rey being an abandon daughter of some Jakku drunks that turned into a hero and a Jedi is a much better story.