SPECULATION THE OFFICIAL SNOKE DISCUSSION THREAD

Exactly @JediMasterRobert

The Plagueis stuff was where the thread ended up but it was the journey that mattered
I had to offer an answer for who Snoke was and how he had knowledge when Luke has very little.
But for me this thread should be more about the challenge Luke faces and how that links in to why he went to Ahch-To and then what Snoke is about.

I'm not 100% on Plagueis. I'm totally aware that there are other theories and arguments against. I personally just think it is the best theory.

 

Instead of being about if Snoke is Plagueis, this thread is about how Snoke could be Plagueis. In this thread, you'll see things like "Plagueis was doing x during I-VI" rather than "I think Snoke is Plagueis because x."

 

Totally agree, master_shaitan.

I was trying to locate a link to your reference (photo + text) to Snoke at the start of this thread, and I think I found it:

Star Wars 101: Servants of the Dark Side Meet those who embraced anger, fear, and aggression.
http://www.starwars.com/news/star-wars-101-servants-of-the-dark-side

With regards to the possible Snoke-as-Wizard-of-Oz theory, here's some food for thought, also from StarWars.com:

The Cinema Behind Star Wars: The Wizard of Oz
http://www.starwars.com/news/the-cinema-behind-star-wars-the-wizard-of-oz

An interesting quote:

I always considered Palpatine the "Phantom Menace," but, now that I think about it, if Snoke really did watch the rise and fall of the Empire, perhaps he/it could be the actual original Phantom Menace...? (Retcon alert?)



"The Wizard of Oz is one because... because... because... because..."

JediMasterRobert

 

I think he got his replacement hand in the Rebel Fleet.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 8, 2016, Original Post Date: Feb 8, 2016 ---

Sort of sounds like Voldemort while he was away 11 years after trying to kill Harry.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 8, 2016 ---

Oh dear, the more I read the more I think of stuff from the Harry Potter universe... Polyjuice potion? Lol.

 

I was informed recently that dir JJ Abrams told a large group of comic fans at a event that Snoke is NOT Darth Plaguis but a completely new character.

If I get any new details about this bold statement, I will post it.

TFM

 

Unfortunately that won't do any good.

The Plagueis hard-ons will just say he is lying.

Oh how the darkside has clouded their minds, forever will it dominate their destiny...

 

LOL. It could be nice to see that "confirmed," for those of us eager to understand more about Snoke.

BTW, I have always tried to avoid spoilers concerning Star Wars, but Luke Skywalker being completely displaced from Episode VII makes me very curious as to who or what Snoke is.

Before Star Trek: Into Darkness came out Abrams was said to have stated Khan was not the villian:
http://io9.gizmodo.com/j-j-abrams-admits-lying-about-star-trek-2s-khan-was-a-1475078061

But it was Kahn.

And reportedly, after the film's debut, Abrams reconsidered the effectiveness and aftereffects of the denial, especially among fans.

Could history repeat itself?

I would hope by December 2017 we will have a much better idea about Snoke, Rey, and Luke.

JediMasterRobert

 

Was that San Diego ComicCon? If so this is old news. What JJ and Larry said was "dodge the question, jump over the question, Darth Vegas, right, left, ah..." followed by essentially a statement that there will be no reference to Darth Plagueis as it relates to Rey's staff in the Force Awakens. It was a truthful answer, if not entirely awkward, suspicious, and a total non-answer.

 

Ok, so other than Plagueis, who could Snoke be? What would be the best backstory?
In my view it has to tie in with:

1. Darth Vader
2. The Skywalkers
3. Balance being restored in Episode VI
4. Not having emerged until after the Sith's demise
5. Injuries being explained
6. Where he acquired his extensive Dark Side knowledge

 

Regardless of all the evidence for and against (let's call this the science), I think as an Art, having Snoke be Plageius is just a really damn good idea. I know this is just an opinion (art) and not a science (fact) but I would like to think this is BY FAR the best possible idea/scenario out there. It will A) bring everything together story wise from the originals, B) Please a lot of fans! and C) Bring about a return of the Sith which the space opera is just as much about as the Jedi!

Just a freaking SICK idea. I don't think the entire think tank could come up with a better idea given the chips they have already been dealt because of EP 1-6.

 

Ahhh. so that is what a regurgitated Fett looks like!

 

I don't think JJA's Snoke remarks were in the last SDCC but post TFA release when the character & his name-description were common knowledge to the fans.

I also say in response to a few recent comments posted, that Snoke may be fearful of Luke Skywalker or Skywalkers in general for a specific reason.
He may have had a hand in their creation or the early formation of Darth Plaguis's plot.
The "re-encarnation" story line seems a bit far reaching but it could be plausible.
Part of it may be Snoke being so old & decayed that he's dying or so sick-injured that he needs a new body-form to transfer his soul.
As Yoda instructed Luke in TESB(1980), maybe Snoke taught-mentored Ben Solo.

 

This idea is really growing on me. All Snoke would need is a really sound understanding of human psychology, of what makes people tick, and he could play force-sensitive people off against each other, or make them knock themselves out (like he did with Kylo).

It would be kind of funny (in a tragic way) if Kylo was simply paranoid about Snoke "sensing" stuff about him when, in reality, Snoke had obtained all his information from spies and informants everywhere (Bala-tik as an example). That WOULD be a great twist. I don't recall a single scene in TFA where Snoke has actually used the Force. That's why he wouldn't train Kylo, I guess.

 

while i agree we never see him use it, he is ostensibly training Kylo Ren (though badly ~ and maybe badly on purpose). we know this is true because Ren appeals to him for his guidance twice (in dealing with his father "by the grace of your training"; and in breaking Rey "with your guidance"). also Snoke threatens to "show him the Darkside" as punishment for his failure (this is in the novel/script--not in the film).

sure, it could be all poof and magic mirrors (it's not out of the realm of possibility that he harnesses other Force users for his own gain), but it is strongly suggested that he knows the Force well enough to exploit it in warping Ren's mind and building up the FO.

 

"There has been an awakening...have you felt it?".

But apart from that...

 

Yes he SAYS that. But he could have gotten the info from Phasma, without any Force use, and then show off to Kylo. Just saying.

 

Because Phasna is force sensitive now? I'm pretty sure that a guy describes as a powerful figure on the Dark Side of the Force is, well, exactly that. In the novel Snoke even speaks with Rey through the Force, telling her to kill Kylo.

 

I haven't been suggesting that Phasma is force-sensitive. Only that she is also a senior FO employee in a position to relay information to the FO's Supreme Leader.

Are you suggesting that Snoke only knows the things about the FO that Hux and Kylo tell him to his face in that assembly room? The info the FO received from Bala-tik, about Han Solo being in the possession of the droid and the Falcon, is passed on to Snoke without Hux and Kylo Ren knowing.

If the novel, which I haven't read, describes Snoke as a powerful "user of the Dark Side of the Force", I'd greatly appreciate it if you could quote a relevant passage proving that the Force obeys Snoke's commands.

I'm not in any way emotionally invested in Snoke's character arc. I'm simply agreeing with a previous poster that the evidence for Snoke's Force-abilities doesn't come from the movie itself.

 

Huh? To sense the force awakening Snoke has to be FS. You said perhaps Phasma relayed that info to him?

JJ called him a powerful figure on the DS.

The novel has him communicating with Rey through the Force.

We know he trained Kylo.

There's no mystery here, he is FS.

 

I'm sorry but I don't see the evidence of Force use in any of the examples you quote.

Snoke has been informed that the brainwashing of Stormtroopers has become less effective, and now Finn has defected. That's all that's necessary for the "There's been an awakening" line to make sense. Snoke doesn't say he learned of it by feeling, he's asking Kylo if he felt it.

A powerful figure doesn't need to be Force-sensitive. Hitler and Stalin were powerful figures, too.

You still haven't quoted any passage of the novel identifying a voice Rey may hear through the Force as Snoke's.

We don't know if Kylo has ever met Snoke in person, so I don't see any evidence that Snoke's training of an already accomplished Force-user was more than guidance via hologram.

I really think that arguing about such points would be far more enjoyable if we took the trouble to back up our arguments with specific and tangible evidence that can actually be verified or falsified, rather than broad and sweeping statements.