THREAD FOR THOSE WHO HATED THE MOVIE

It was brought to my attention weeks ago that TLJ wasn't in the Top 100 (before release day) because Amazon blocked TLJ pre-orders like they do for other Disney titles. Other unreleased titles from other studios were in the Top 100 at the time.

 

Has anyone seen this?

 

gets to the core of the main problem of TLJ.

 

Yeah, pretty much how I feel and think about the movie. No hard feeling to RJ, for a producer taking on a SW film is probably comparable to trying to top Mount Everest for a mountain climber. JJ sent him off with weather that wasn't optimal to begin with (it was great in the sense to drive fan interest and guarantee people in seats looking for answers, not so good because there were no answers to those mystery boxes, so RJ was responsible to come up with answers for all of them).

Doesn't matter how great the pictures he got on his partial climb, he didn't summit. With all that time and effort and money put into the endeavor, failing to summit can only be seen as a failure, though you can definitely garner a great deal from the experience.

 

You all may be willing to let RJ off the hook, I'm not. I do think some fair share of the angst goes to KK because I am confident the Leia Mary Poppins scene is a direct result of KK's input. To be clear, I think KK was right in basically demanding logical coherence with regard to Leia and Force Usage, she was the daughter of the chosen one, her passive use of the Force (to me) was always problematic. She SHOULD have been using the Force, KK was right about that, but the hamfisted representation of how it was done? Definitely a point to critique. And yes JJ should get some blame, if he was aware ahead of time that the Writers after him had latitude to take the story where they wanted, he should have either provided the answers to his mystery boxes as an input into TLJ, or he shouldn't have introduced the mystery boxes PERIOD.

None of that excuses Rian's choices. He still has an obligation to honor metadata that came before his movie (not just in terms of this trilogy, but the franchise) - and I don't think he did. He still had an obligation to provide threads of continuity for the next movie - and I don't think he did. It's fine to say JJ left Rian to answer his mystery boxes, it was Rian's choice to subvert them. There was nothing artistic about that or even necessary for the story he chose to tell. He doesn't get a pass for that from me.

The one thing that that video got right is that the characters here are being heavily plot driven; and as is often the result, they end up taking actions that seem to make no sense. You get the feel of people moving to pre-ordained positions, not because it's in their character or behavior or that they were motivated by sentient thought, emotion, or some attribute of their personality, but because that's where the Director needed them to be for his story. That feels like the core of the problem of this movie. Rian's choice was to make this story principally about empathizing and understanding Kylo and it feels like EVERY other character is made a function of that goal. Luke is reimagined as a self-loathing failure, Rey's entire mission becomes about redeeming Kylo, Poe's mission is doomed to fail so that we can pretend failure is a teacher is a major theme, and Finn gets launched into a tertiary plot where he repeats his arc from TFA for the benefit of Poe's mission failing. I don't give Rian a pass for any of that.

 

It sold out at Target and Walmart as well.

 

You can literally order it from both Target and Walmart right now. I just checked. It is not sold out. Not sure where you got the information that you couldn't.

 

I'm waiting for someone to say : Hey it's was so fantastic that I bought 3 DVDs just to prove the haters how brilliant it was !!

I don't care if Disney is making money out of this ( except for my 15€ ), I've no tie with this company.

 

It's just the same old from those who loved TLJ. Running into this thread with this nonsense as some sort of proof that everyone loved the movie and the only people who didn't like it are us and 6 other people in the world.

I keep seeing TLJ as an option for digital download and I cannot bring myself to spend anymore money on it and I have no desire to watch it again. I'm reading these posts about seeing it over and over makes it better... I can't do it. I cringe at the thought of watching bad, misplaced humor, milking scenes and Leia Poppins again. Maybe someday I'll watch it again....maybe.

 

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/...l-and-march-27th-blu-ray-dvd.50047418/page-23
Look through the last few pages. Many people saying it's sold out at their local stores. Anecdotal, but still.

 

At work, I know about 15 people who saw the movie, 5 liked it, 10 didn't.

Most of the people who liked it are not that implied in SW and they told me : Put your brain off, it's nice, nobody cares about the story.

 

Spoiler

If memory serves, this political rival found an old holo-vid recording of Bail Organa telling Leia the truth about her parentage.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2018, Original Post Date: Mar 30, 2018 ---

Yes, I did happen to notice the fact that the people who liked TLJ are, quite conveniently, the same ones telling us it is sold out.

All I know is this: At my local Best Buy, there is a big display up front and as of this morning there were TONS of TLJ blu-rays available in each of the different formats they released to Best Buy. I also see that right now you can't get directly from Amazon, but Disney and Amazon hate each other and buying Disney movies from Amazon is a major pain. So that doesn't mean "sold out."

 

Eh, that post comes off as a tad elitist. "not that implied in SW"? I'm guessing you mean "not real fans" or regular people who definitely don't discuss it in forums, haha. I just watched ALL of the SW movies in the last 3 months, but I'm in deep. Maybe my opinion isn't as valuable, either? I like TLJ, but I feel like Rian Johnson could have done a better job with various aspects, surely.

 

I just say things as they are. If someone doesn't know who Tarkin, Mace Windu or Ahsoka Tano are, I'm not counting them as Star Wars fans.

They just go to the theater with job tickets and if they see the last jedi or Thor III, it is the same for them.

One funny thing is that most ecstatic about the movie couldn't even remember if he had seen ep VII or not.

BTW, we finally found out that he had.

I'm quite sure he already forgot about ep VIII. I wish I could.

 

I downloaded it the first day it came out - for free - after few days and two glasses of wine I tried click here and there.....and I could´t watch it :-( it was too bad and too embarssing.....it´s not on my hard drive anymore, I know I just don´t want to see this ever again. There´s one thing positive tho - in two years when so many fans wil be angy again - I will be perfectly happy and calm, because I wouldn´t care

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 30, 2018, Original Post Date: Mar 30, 2018 ---

That´s just impossible - Luke was the one who told her. It´s in Return of the Jedi! She didn´t know before! She didn´t know the whole OT until Luke told her.....come on

 

Well, if Luke said to Leia that he is her brother and Vader was his dad, it might had ring a bell to the princess.

 

The following is a response from a “non-hater” to a previous post with the only purpose of discussing a SW movie with those interested.

Spoiler: Anyone not interested in or offended by different opinions may be best to ignore this post.

I don't think Rian shoehorned characters into an already prepared story although it may feel that way to some.
Rian said that before he had formulated a script he sat down and analyzed each characters strengths and weaknesses.
He then wrote a story that specifically challenged each character's weaknesses.
He said he exploited whatever weakness allowed for the most drama.

Fair enough but the fact that Kylo and Rey are two halves of a protagonist (hero and anti-villain) kinda requires that the story principally be about understanding Kylo and Rey.

It's not much of a "reimagination".
OT Luke was often moody and stubborn and his reactions in TLJ can be seen as entirely plausible.
He always comes around to showing strength in the face of adversity.

Only if you ignore all of her learning about the Jedi, the ways of the Force, and her quest to find her place in all this.
Rey's is an existential journey that's aligned and intertwined with the nemisis/kindred spirit she is literally bonded to.

Or it is an arc completely in line with the weaknesses of a hotshot character.
Poe shares many of the flaws that the Jedi had during the Clone Wars.
He's better than everyone else and this makes him capable of succumbing to certain dangers:
acting with impunity, hubris, arrogance, impulsiveness, acting out of fear and anger etc.

In TFA he wanted to avoid the war but in the end his concern for Rey is greater than his desire to flee and he is drawn back into the fray.
Come TLJ he still wants to avoid the war and help protect Rey but learns that his interests actually line up with Reys and the Resistance.
His arc in this film is his journey to this realization with the help of Rose.

My take anyways.

 

And those aro the only two people who knew. So if some writer made up that she was told by B.O. that´s just B.S.

 

Definitely an observation I also made, both among friends and youtube reviewers.
Not to say there aren't hardcore fans who like TLJ - there are many here in the cantina - but among general audiences there seems to be some correlation between people who, for example, think Jyn and Rey are the same character and people who like TLJ. I guess if you barely remember anything about previous movies you're not as bothered by inconsistencies or lack of an overarching big picture story.

 

The most funny thing is to hear them don't spoil, don't spoil like 2 months after the movie is released and you can't talk about it at lunch and when they finally decide to go to the theater they don't know if they saw a SW or guardians of the galaxy.