SPECULATION Why Did Ben Solo Turn to the Dark Side?

Yeah, I think once everyone got over the shock, they'd realize that of course she wasn't in league with Vader. But she did deceive them in a sense (by omission) about who her real father was--which they will never forgive her for--and I can imagine everyone wondering how much like him she really is under the surface and second-guessing her motives forever after. She does have the bloodline, after all...

 

That's one of those things that you'd do ideally because it's the right thing to do...but when it comes right down to it, especially if you had never managed to deal with the fact (and all its painful implications) yourself, or figure out how you would deal with Ben's reaction, you might very well keep telling yourself that there's no rush--no one else knows, or he's too young to understand, or there's a better time in the future, or Luke could do it better because he knows the truth about Vader's redemption, or he needs someone who understands the Force to explain it to him, or he's having such a struggle right now that another time would be more suitable... (Or at least, that's how I imagine me dealing with it!)

It would be so easy to rationalize putting it off, all with the very best of intentions.

 

Especially if the story of The Clone Wars was somehow known - by word of mouth or whatnot - about the legendary Jedi knight Anakin Skywalker who fought bravely for the Old Republic and then became the Dark Lord of the Sith. People might wonder if she is at one point going to join the Dark Side. And if years later, it is known that her son became part of the First Order, that would enhance that theory - that her legacy is tainted just for being a Skywalker.

As Dumbledore said: "“We must all face the choice between what is right and what is easy.”

The right thing of course would have been to tell Ben the truth as soon as he was old enough to understand - and by that, I mean being a boy could do.

But if as you said, his parents - or at least, his mother - haven't come to terms with that truth, obviously excuses will come and the truth revelation will be postponed by this or that.

Even in real life, we face or we know people that face similar situations. An acquaintance always told her daughter, born out of wedlock, that the little girl's father had died when she was very young. Some years later, someone accidentally told this lady that her daughter's father just had died - in front of the girl, so the daughter was shocked of being lied about it, and had some rough teenage years. Maybe the example is quite basic but it's in some way similar.

 

Before the prequels, I like a great many people I imagine, thought that Anakin Skywalker would be good but have a dark edge to him.
But when The Phantom Menace came out what we got was essentially a very good kid. And one younger than we thought (and hoped for).
I felt that seeing Kylo Ren, he was the Anakin I thought we'd get. You can imagine him when he was Ben:
A complicated person. Both good but with a darkness within him that should be watched. Talented. Powerful. That's the Anakin I envisaged.

My thoughts on Ben are that he has always had a darkness to him.
In the book We Need To Talk About Kevin, the mother worries whether both her reluctance to ever have a child resulted in Kevin turning into a "monster".
I wonder whether this happened with Ben and Leia, in some way? Were Han and Leia distrusting of him? I'm sure Leia wanted children, but did she have concerns about who they might become? Did this become a fulfilling prophecy? Did Ben always feel different?

Snoke is said to have watched Ben from the beginning from the shadows and there are many hints that he knew Leia at least.
Did Snoke stoke the fires of doubt in both mother and child?
Then when Ben discovered the truth - that Vader was Anakin Skywalker, his grandfather - did this in some way confirm in his mind that the darkness he felt was, in a way, "natural" and the reason why he was always treated differently?

Anyway, for me Ben was clearly a kid with a lot of power that he didn't have an outlet for.
His parents were heroes who a) didn't spend enough time with him and b) held things back from him.
He had Snoke, somehow, whispering in his ear (either perhaps tricking him by pretending to be a voice in his head/Vader or simply by being the father figure that Ben wanted and like how Palpatine was to Anakin) since the start of his life.
As a person, he held the power his family had in high esteem. Like most if not every person, he had a Dark Side but this was perhaps more visible than with others - As @FN-3263827 will tell you, Ren Ben is an open book. Maybe this separated him from people? Han seemed to suggest that with his "too much Vader in him", comment.

And so the two remaining nails in the coffin for Ben, so to speak, were being sent away by his mother and then learning Vader was Granddad.
For a kid who's parents have perhaps shown concern, a kid who feels different to everyone else and is neglected - his own mother sending him away was a massive mistake. It would've cemented in his mind that there was something wrong with him and that he wasn't wanted. If this is how people see him, hell, why not go down that path anyway? Besides, it appears that it could make him more powerful...
Finally, after the Vader reveal it confirms all that - and he interprets the strange dreams and visions as being messages from his grandfather - the Dark one, another Skywalker pariah. With Snoke's brainwashing it suddenly reveals a destiny to Ren Ben - a path, a meaning. To finish what Vader started.

The question is, what the hell is it he thinks Vader started?
Is it something Snoke has put in his head? Does he have a different perspective on balancing the Force? Does he just want ultimate power? Or does he want to convert Vader's family to the Dark Side and with their combined strength rule the galaxy?

I think his turn can be justified (I once didn't). And once you turn, it's a very quick downhill motion towards unspeakable evil. Killing innocent villagers, torturing girls, murdering your father and keeping the ashes of your victims becomes very easy. But it will be interesting to see Ren's ultimate goals be revealed...

 

That's what I mean: if people knew beforehand tales about that legendary Jedi named Anakin Skywalker and then they found out he became Vader by the leak in the Senate, that would be quite an impact on how you can have someone who supposedly belongs to the light side and goes bad.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 8, 2016, Original Post Date: Sep 8, 2016 ---

That's an interesting comparison. So far we don't know what was Leia's perspective regarding her Skywalker heritage. From the Legends, we do know that she had a hard time coming to terms with the fact that Anakin/Vader was her biological father, and due to that, she was reluctant to have kids in the first place. Only when she learns more from Anakin's past as a slave boy in Tatooine and finds a journal written by Shmi, she realizes the one she knew as Darth Vader was once Anakin Skywalker: a good-natured boy who was selfless enough to help three perfect unknown individuals, and then she decides to have children.

However, that is supposed to have happened like 4,5 years after Endor.

In the current canon though, so far we just know the facts: Han and Leia married right there after the Battle of Endor, and were expecting their son during the year afterwards. We have some glimpses of her obvious reluctance to accept her origin but we don't have evidence of her reluctance to have children due to her heritage - well, other than that scene on Aftermath : Life Debt Chapter 15 where she wonders about her legacy and her son's legacy, but that's it.

Another thing is that if Ben perceived that she was FS too but didn't want to pursue learning the Ways of the Force, in some way would be rejecting him as well, since let's say she didn't want to have the same learning and development as her kid - or saying it easier, to be trained enough in the Force so she could train him instead of sending him to Uncle Luke.

 

interesting. that really does sound like something that a young kid would have issues with:-
"your sending me away to learn this stuff, but you rejected it?"

you really can't choose your own parents lol.

it's a pity that in both the real world and science fiction.. we are looked down upon because of the actions of others.

 

@master_shaitan I've considered most of the main points you've raised at various times, and generally think similarly in regards to most of them. But I confess I haven't fully considered the implications of exactly how much Snoke might have manipulated Ren into finishing what Vader started vs Ren coming to this conclusion off his own bat, and think it's a pretty interesting question.

Ren seems to have a closer relationship with his idol Vader than Snoke in some ways. After all, he confesses his fears about Snoke to the mask. Why not just bypass the mask and be up front with Snoke about things, like how Vader was with the Emperor? The only conclusion I can come to is that Snoke is just his teacher, not his Master, and Ren knows deep down that at some point his goals and his teachers will diverge, but that he is not yet in a position to make his own goals the priority. I concur that it will be very interesting to see Ren's ultimate goals revealed.

Obviously some of the biggest questions that are currently very hard to answer, due to the limited information, include what is it that motivates Snoke, how does his mind really work? How does that tie into his ultimate goal, and what really is his ultimate goal? Being shadier than an sitting under an oak tree durring a new moon at midnight, it's hard to say if something is merely a means or an end with Snokesy. I think we'll probably end up thinking a lot of the 'means' are 'ends' long before we get the reveal of his ultimate goal and motivations. Feints within feints. This could possibly be true of Ren as well really.

Another possibility is that Ren's goals might be revealed and then he abandons them or changes them I suppose.

All very interesting points of speculation...

 

I know!! That would in some way make him feel betrayed and rejected.

Here is a quote from that Legends book, "Tatooine Ghost":

In some way I pity that this book is no longer canon but if that were the case, we wouldn't have the current conflict of the ST of the offspring going to the Dark side due to unacknowledged heritage.

 

This artwork Drew Baker did for a 'private commision' is interesting.

 

Could this drawing have been concept art for the scene we now know as in which Kylo talks to Vader's helmet? Maybe they were switched at some point?

 

Hmm. I wonder what this is about?

The last two frames remind me very much of the body language of Kylo Ren in the cockpit of the Falcon in the deleted scene.





Maybe it's the same "pull to the Light" conflict we see in the Communing with Vader's Helmet scene?

 

The professional artist (who did SW artwork before) doesn't say for what it is, he only hints that it is for 'private commision', whatever this means.

 

via [1]

 

I can believe never telling him. One reason, Leia had trouble dealing with it herself. Another reason, it was a pretty heavy thing to know about. There are things in my family I wish I didn't know because it's now a burden of sorts. I can imagine they never even thought it would ever come out. They thinking they were the only ones that knew. Oddly, it was revealed by one of the few deceased characters who knew about the Skywalker children before it got out, years after he died and in an act of love.

 

And I just watched the episode 216 from TCW ("Cat and Mouse") where Anakin runs through the Separatist blockad over Christophsis to help Senator Organa. Geez, I cannot see this without thinking of poor Bail, raising Leia and thinking of her two parents the way they were back then.

 

I watched that recently as well and thought the same things. Up to where little boy Boba Fett is starting to show up again.

 

this is an important distinction for Ren, I think. he seems to consider Snoke his mentor (replacement figure for Luke). he still yearns for a father figure in Vader perhaps. some part of him still distinguishes this adopted family of Snoke and the FO as separate and possibly inferior to his "real" family (or at least the desire for his real family).

which we can once again speculate on contrasts is Rey is "adopted" by Luke and comes to distinguish him as separate and superior to her own "real" family.

just flipping that two-sided coin again.

the body language in that scene is so devastating. we don't get it in the Vader scene or on the bridge, which is a shame.
but maybe we'll see something like in in espisode viii. much as i hate to see Ben crushed, i'd welcome it if it means death to Kylo Ren.

 

Because he wanted to keep long hair but Han wasn't allowing it.