Why is everyone here so obsessed with Darth Plagueis??

Why do you keep misinterpreted what i have wrote, thats twice now. yes i agree the story 1-7 all interconnected. 7 runs directly on from 6 though.

This is pretty clear.

 

"Creating" life and "cheating" death does not equal "immortal". Plagueis is not a God and Sidious is a liar

 

You would have to assume plagues to have expressed his intentions or what would Sidious be believing. how would he qualify plagues power.

 

The details to this story are no longer canon as the Plagueis novel is no longer canon so trying to argue about the motives of two characters and how they worked is pretty much shooting blind.

If you look at the previous novel. Plaguies had an able student and Sidious was going to get to be Emperor while Plagueis ruled from behind the throne. Once they started their plan. He killed Plagueis because he didn't really want to be a puppet.

 

so were kind of back to my original point.
Why speculate, we have a villain in snoke already, why does he have to be any more than just what he's been presented as?

 

It's been a looong morning and I'm not thinking fully straight. So forgive me.

It does connect straight from 6 but, that doesn't mean that things established in the Prequels couldn't be used later for the Sequels. Like with things I speculated upon. There has to be a reason certain elements from them weren't explained.

Two of the Big Reasons for This:

1. ‘If you follow the direction, and project into the final trilogy, you realise that you’re going to meet the supreme intellect, and you think how is it possible to create a man who has such profound cunning that he can not only control Darth Vader, but the fate of Luke Skywalker? Control the destiny of the whole galaxy? You’ll be amazed!’ - Richard Marquand

2. "It deals with the character that survives Star Wars III and his adventures." - George Lucas in 1980 during an interview with Banta Tracks. This quote has led to speculation that a character from the prequel trilogy would be frozen at the end of Episode III, hibernate through the Galactic Civil War & be revived for Episode VII. (Sounds just like Snoke)

 

You know, I've been hearing theories on here that Anakin Skywalker is really Rey AND vice-versa. I personally don't believe in that theory. Although, to put a spin on that theory, what if Plageuis really is Anakon Skywalker which is why he's able to fall so easily to the dark side besides his love for Padmé. Place his and the Sith propagated the theory of "The Chosen One" from the shadows since the dawn of the Jedi and Plageuis took this opportunity to BECOME Anakin Skywalker with his ultimate plan to rule forever. He used the force to re-incarnate into Anakon Skywalker and also Darth Vader. So that seed of evil in Skywalker is really Plageuis . He was able to destroy the Jedi as a result and his old apprentice eventually. When Vader/a skin died, their souls were pulled apart and plague is finally destroyed and a skin becoming the light side again .

 

Ask someone who wants DP in the film or thinks that he is Snoke.

I was simply jumping in because of other issues you raise that I wanted to discuss.

 

If Snoke is a new character then he is a complete retcon.
Plagueis is too good an opportunity to miss in my view to:
a) Tie all the films together
b) Introduce a villain with a different power for the heroes to overcome
c) Expand upon the Skywalker lineage and saga
d) Allow us to view the PT in a new way

Plagueis can be made to be Snoke without contradicting anything, be easily explained (as we know from ROTS he had the power to do certain remarkable things) and tie in with the prophesy and the balance of the Force.

 

How is Snoke a retcon if he is a new character?

 

Its cool.

1. This is the emperor right?

2. i need more context that what you have presented.
no one was frozen at then end of episode 3.

if you have watched the (lucas making of the phantom menace) George was clearly struggling with the script and defiantly didn't have a determined plan, from the 80's already hashed out. or it would of been written in the interim 30 years.

so no i don't think these two are valid points? just point to make your point taken out of context. really long morning, i guess?

 

I think that's all speculation on fans' parts...from everything that we've been told from everyone, Snoke is very much a new bars get that had been around for s very long time .

 

Evening MS. thought we might see you back lol.

Good point. I think Snoke as Snoke works equally well though?
same setup just without plagues.

 

Because he has apparently been around to watch the rise and fall of the Empire.
So what has this extremely powerful Dark Side been doing all this time and why suddenly emerge after the fall of the Empire?

Plagueis COULD have created Anakin. He trained Sidious. That alone put him front and centre of the saga.
On top of that we know he had the ability to keeps others safe from death so it isn't a big jump to suggest he did learn it for himself.
And on a metaphorical level, the whole myth will be far more satisfactory (in regard to the Skywalker saga) if their lives have been cursed (or plagued) by this guy from the start and this curse won't be lifted until his demise.

 

Three time's the charm

 

Who is he? Where has he been? Where did he learn the Dark Side from? Why didn't he try to take over the galaxy sooner? Why attack now? What caused his injuries? How did he know Ben Solo was a Skywalker?

If it's Plagueis these are all answered:

He's a former Sith.
Been in exile after being badly injured by Sidious.
Learned Dark Side from being a Sith, obv.
Couldn't take over galaxy as Sidious had to much power and was a threat to him.
Attacking now as vacuum for power (and possibly needs to put the Force out of balance again to keep himself alive - lives off Dark Side).
Sidious injured him with Force lightning.
His close connection to the Skywalkers (as he created Anakin) enabled him to know Kylo's power and potential.

 

1. It's a quote in relation to the Sequel Trilogy. So it's not the Emperor.

2. The quote noteworthy includes information that it's been misinterpreted. So it's highly possible the workings of things changed around a bit. As does every story change over time.

He actually did have a plan and about a 15 page outline for everything. During the writing documentary in the notes he's writing there's a piece of paper that says "Who is father?" in relation to Anakin. As well as there's connecting threads between each I and II that ultimately are Anakin's undoing. His attachment (Mother and Padme later on) and wanting to know how to stop people from dying as he promises Padme he will learn. He certainly had outlines for what the stories would be but, like any story, they'd involve and change over time. A few things remained in TPM like C-3PO being found at a junkyard if I am not mistaken and R2's introduction is almost exactly like it was originally planned. Ultimately, he may not have had everything but, he had the base to what happens in the stories. As Ian McDiarmid says in the commentary of TPM.

 

i get what your saying.
im not sure a sith would hang up his boots as it were. i think once in never out. or some one just kills you?
plagues was killed though?
in 90 years if he was unable to recoup and challenge he is less of a villain than vader of sidious.
the apprentice killed him in his sleep.

i think personal its to much of a push, snoke can easily be all them thing already. with out the tie in.
we no nothing of manikins birth other than the mother saying there was no father.

i would like the focus to drop off from snoke
create a hierarchical structure that means snoke remains some what obscured till later and we only see lower SITH.
MAIN LEADER/ mystic type / snoke
his apprentice

few more layers

than kylo ren
knight of ren

it means at the end of these 3 movies we're not stuck with a story that can only go backwards on itself?
Have snoke as the main ruling sith that we never quite get high enough to deal with. but we find a little more about over the years.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 16, 2016, Original Post Date: Jan 16, 2016 ---

maybe provide a little context then mate?
but sure ok.

but there was no freezing was there, and luke hadn't even been born.

 

He was around in a galaxy of thousands of worlds. I think there is room for many characters who might have been alive 60 years ago. Also a retcon changes a story what changes to the story does someone alive and been around make. Even if this were considered a Retcon which I don't think it meets the definition. Why is that a bad thing coming from a proponent of the theory that requires a dead character to return to life in defiance of the cannon.

Vader and Vader's legacy are more front and center on the saga than DP. The evidence of this is that the first 6 movies were about Vader and the 7th there is a character talking to his old helmet wishing he could measure up. There is a connection to the rest of the Saga. Its evident in the film does not require remembering a name said once in film 3 and supplemental material that may or may not be canon.

As elegant an idea as the curse on the Skywalkers is its your idea inorder to make the return of DP fit the story. Its not something ever mentioned by the story group or in any canon source. Its part of your speculation.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 16, 2016, Original Post Date: Jan 16, 2016 ---

So he is a mystery?

Also many of those questions can still be aimed at DP because they aren't answered. You have provided speculation to answer them. But there is not definitive answer to where DP was and why he did not act. So I am having difficulty understanding it as evidence or a better case for DP being Snoke than Snoke being Snoke.

 

Richard Marquand (22 September 1937 – 4 September 1987) was a Welsh film director, best known for directing Return of the Jedi.

This was clearly the emperor ?
The final trilogy being, the return of the jedi. the film he was directing.
where we meet the emperor. who up until then we know nothing about.

@Pastor Barndog and @master_shaitan

I've got to agree.

also one worry is
if we except plagues its small steps to bringing back vader.