SPECULATION Why Snoke has become most important character

I appreciate your leap in logic, because I agree Qui Gon did learn how to "cheat oblivion," and that becoming a Force ghost is indeed cheating oblivion. However, it does not state anywhere that Palpatine KNEW Qui Gon could, nor does it state anywhere that becoming a Force ghost is what Palaptine is referring to when he says "cheating death." It seems clear, and Hidalgo's comments make it clearer, that Palpatine is referring to Plagueis, and that he means Plagueis' abilities to save others from death (rather than himself).

 

I myself wish he was an ex-Sith, that we may or may have heard, like a Sith from Korriban from the EU, brought forward in the canon, would really make a lot of sense because the FO are a new version of The Empire and an ex Sith leading them would make a lot thematic sense imo, but who knows he probably is from the URs because of the canon.

 

So going by what is said in the movie is a leap of logic now?

However if go by the argument (which has to ignore - QUI-GON: (V.O.) The ability to defy oblivion can be achieved, but only for oneself. It was accomplished by a Shaman of the Whills. It is a state acquired through compassion, not greed. - to be right) you laid out - Snoke can't be Plagueis cause Plagueis is dead. Which is my point.

So........whether we go by my argument or yours - Snoke isn't Plagueis?

 

I'm not arguing at all. Haha. It's OK by me if Snoke isn't Plagueis, and you're right, he probably isn't. I just don't want Snoke to be some random with no ties to the threads of the major story arc of the 9 films. That's all. So if his backstory is similar to DP, or if his backstory has bearing on/roots in the PT and OT, I am a happy person. If he is just some random, I am not.

My only point is that the things you were saying were never explicitly stated anywhere. Not that I think they're wrong. Just that they have not been established as Canon. The following is Canon:

- Qui Gon can "defy oblivion" by becoming a Force ghost. Nobody ever says this is the same as being not dead.
- Palpatine SAYS there is one that can "cheat death." He never says who, but the only individual he has been talking about in the scene is DP. It is never established anywhere if he meant DP or Qui Gon, and whether Palpatine knew about Qui Gon's abilities or Force Ghosts at all.
- Neither Palpatine nor Qui Gon ever say becoming a Force Ghost is equivalent to cheating death.
- Pablo Hidalgo says DP could save others he cared for from death, not himself, and that this is what is meant by "cheating death."

But hey, it's just fun to discuss, no?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

He does have ties - just watch TFA. Not every character needs to show up in the PT, then again in the ST,.

The stuff about Qui-Gon is explicitly stated. Yoda says QUi-Gon discovered the secret to immortality, literally defined as living forever. Palpatine says there is one who can cheat death, then we find out from Yoda who that is. I realize taking two pieces of information can be confusing, but I'm sure you can do it.

 

Jedi souls after phisical death are joining the Force.Qin gon Jinn discovered how to comunicate with the Living. Sith can not do that.their souls go into oblivion after death,so their ultimate Quest was Always to prolong their life and acheive immortality in their body. Even if Snoke is not a Plagueis and no Sith his passion is to became immortal we can be sure in that

 

Who's passion, Snoke or plagueis?

 

his one

Look how far he came carried by this Quest for immortality,he even do not need a mask that helped him breath because of that massive old injury on his cheek and trachea, and deep wound that reaches to his brain is not healed but its bridged by Force,it will be interesting to see does he needs now any medical aparatus or he managed to entitely sustain his Vital functions by the Force itself only

 

No, they are two different people.

It would appear that extending life/cheating death was/a goal of Plagueis but Snoke......we dunno yet.

 

I'm trying to be friendly. I am agreeing with you on most things. I don't understand the need for nastiness. Also, I synthesize information for a living. I'm not confused. I don't confuse easily. I just...don't think it's as explicitly stated as you believe it to be. But...it's really no big deal, right?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

We have a character saying - PALPATINE: To cheat death is a power only one has achieved, but if we work together, I know we can discover the secret. (he also NEVER says Plagueis figured out immortality or how to cheat death himself, only others).

Then another character - QUI-GON: (V.O.) The ability to defy oblivion can be achieved, but only for oneself (which would indicate that Palpatine was lying- GASP!!!!) It was accomplished by a Shaman of the Whills. It is a state acquired through compassion, not greed.

And Another - YODA: An old friend has learned the path to immortality

And we have Hidalgo saying Plagueis never figured out how to keep himself from dying AND WAS KILLED BY HIS APPRENTICE

Its endlessly fustrating to go the length so finding all this stuff for you, the have it all called "a leap in logic" and that these things which characters have said and which Hidalgo has confirmed isn't canon. I find that kind of.....denial in the face of facts "nastiness", so you got some back.

 

You have eyes.Snoke is haevily damaged, every doctor will tell you his injuries are incompatible with life..and did not healed.Whoever he is he is using Force that is suplementing damaged organ functions.

 

Yes i do, and I used them to read the artists intentions with the design.

Even if he is injuried (still possible, I assumed he was too until Ir ead that) we have zero evidence he is using the force to keep himself alive.

From the script -
INT. STARKILLER PLANET - ASSEMBLY ROOM - NIGHT
KYLO REN and General Hux in a dark space, looking UPWARD at
someone addressing them.
We're in a massive and dark ASSEMBLY ROOM. Hundreds of DESKS
in a stadium arc, focused on a platform where we see SUPREME
LEADER SNOKE. Not entirely human, at nearly twenty-five
feet tall. All of him a STONY GREY. Old, wounded, fragile
and powerful, all at the same time.





(CONTINUED)
CONTINUED:
SNOKE
... Leading them to the last Jedi.
If Skywalker returns, the new Jedi
will rise.

So its a combo of the Darkside eating away at him (probably their original idea/plan which they didn't want to lsoe) and some injuries. However - zero evidence of him using the force to keep himself alive. For all we know he is a member of a species that lives 1,000 year's and he is nowhere near death.

 

Ok doctor keep him alive.How old are you please do not be offended please

 

I don't understand this post.

 

I dont understand many things to.

 

There is, by my logic, no race that can evolve to promote such massive defects, its agains law of evolution.

He can be deformed by hologram, but chances are very very low.

There is other option I must offer from the point of fairness: He could be "eaten alive" by the Dark side of the Force. so Force eats his flesh and in Exchange he gets more Dark side power.
Poor being in this case, he is weak and Force must eat him for he to get more Dark Side power, Plagueis will be far less disgusting and more honourable explanataion of such pathetic look.

Did we needed such ugly creature been such without good reason , no.

If he is not Plagueis,and if he realy looks like that, it is than perverted Disney/LSL extravaganza that will not be remembered in the anals of greatest ideas in Star wars, that is for sure.

 

1. I have been reading many of the new canon books trying to get any tiny tidbit of info on who/what Snoke is. So far - nada. Do you two know of any other source other than TFA?
2. If the answer to #1 is "TFA only", I have to agree with Canadian Ronin. You make very strong points McDiarmid. But all that can be gleaned with certainty from TFA is it appears that Snoke is using some power/device/method beyond the abilities of normal people to keep himself alive(if he even is indeed "alive"). The Force is one possibility, but in the GFFA anything is possible.