SPECULATION Knights of Ren

Noted thanks @Bluestreaking, I think the 3rd order was a selected group of force sensitives chosen to perform a resurrection ritual, they tried 30 years earlier but was stopped by Luke but the first order intervened killing a lot of Luke's jedi squad Luke was sent into exile & Leia was put in charge, the group split up till one of them had a vision of a coming return. Kylo was probably a young member one of them spared & took under their wing learning their ways.

 

Isn't it rumored that at one point during the Galactic Civil War (post-Endor), a large remnant of Imperial Forces disappeared into a mysterious nebula and only recently resurfaced as The First Order? My thought is that the KoR dwelt in this nebula, largely isolated and ignorant of the greater galaxy, and their contact with what would become the First Order spurned them to explore and conquer. If this was so, then any knowledge they gained would be skewed through an Imperial perspective; maybe this causes them to see the Jedi as evil, and what led them to send a strike team (the Seven) against Luke's fledgling academy. Now, they've sent the First Order back out into the galaxy under the command of one of their elders (Snoke) and his apprentice (Kylo Ren). The FO thinks they're reforming the Empire, and the Rens think they're expanding upon theirs; both sides are playing each other, but together they present a terrifying threat to the galaxy.

Maybe true, maybe not; but true to the thread, it's separate from the main "Third Order" speculation .

 

Them disappearing into a nebula definitely comes from something canon, though I can't put my finger on what. Them coming out of the nebula as the First Order is our imagination. Just who Snoke is, and if they are the only Imperial remnant, weighs heavily on this part of the history.

 

I like this angle on the origins of the First Order, however how would Kylo Ren's obsession with all things Vader come to be if he was raised in an isolated manner from the greater galaxy? I believe the article also alluded to something about Kylo being somehow connected to characters we already are familiar with.

 

JJ is good at his job, he revealed new important piece of information and instead of answers it only gives us new questions. What/who the hell is "Ren"? Artifact, person, place, weapon, philosophy?

God damn you JJ, god damn you!

 

Yes, but I'm afraid all the questions we've been asking leading up to TFA will be replaced by MORE questions by the end of TFA.

As for the KOR (here we go with more acronyms), it is possible that is the name of Luke's new Jedi order. Perhaps Kylo was one of the first students of Luke's academy. He believes there is too much corruption in the New Republic. He partners with Snoke to help command The First Order and then slaughtered the KOR, leaving him the only remaining. Luke went into exile because he failed, but now A New Hope in the Force has Awakened (Rey and Finn). Do you see where this is going?

 

Hey so why was my thread merged into third order? @Bluestreaking They weren't related in any way. It'd be nice if you fixed that.

EIDT: Then you could get rid of this duplicate thread of my original thread!

 

Hm, I hadn't given thought to the KOR being founded by Luke, as you postulate. It would be pretty interesting if instead of killing all of them, he managed to convert a few of its members and essentially take over and completely change the direction of Luke's order, causing Luke to flee in the process. Possibly even following the same goals and ideals originally set forward by Luke himself, but in a completely different manner and in his own vision.

 

Im thinking it was the Maw installation in "dark apprentice?" One of the better old EU novels. If memory serves, they had the prototype laser for the death star hidden away in there with a group of scientists who didnt know that the war was over post ROTJ and the installations leader was Tarkins bit of rough that assassinated the warring factions of the imperial remnant and lead the attack to retake Corruscant.........anyone else know about this or am I going mad?
Sorry know its off topic but it was bugging me

 

Or all three!

 

That's definitely not what I was thinking of because I never read any of the old EU.

Where I think the nebula thing comes from is that big info dumb on MSW several weeks back about the state of the galaxy after ROTJ. So I'm not sure we have a source yet.

 

I keep thinking of them almost as a Canon version of the Blackguard.

An order of Dark Jedi who revere teh sith, but do not exactly follow their traditions.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 13, 2015, Original Post Date: Aug 13, 2015 ---

concering this nebulae idea, I cant help but think of the Stygean Caldera...

The large nebulae that surrounds sith space.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Stygian_Caldera

 

If the First Order being born out of this nebula rumor is true, I wonder if the reason Luke's lightsaber is so important to everyone is because it was the first lightsaber this race of people ever saw? Maybe the lightsaber being passed around in the rumored flashback is showing how the lightsaber sparked a group to form the Knights of Ren. Maybe it has a sort of religious significance to this group or something like that.

 

I had a few thoughts on this when I first posted but they weren't the best. I'll try to lay them out now though.

Basically, my idea is that the Knights of Ren see the Sith as superior to the Jedi because of their interaction with the First Order; the only Sith they really know about is Vader (as Palpatine's identity as Darth Sidious was not really public knowledge). So while pledging to get rid of the Jedi, they also want to learn more of the Sith. Kylo takes this to the extreme for one reason or the other, and is emulating himself after the former-Sith.

As for his lineage, this could be explained by him being kidnapped at an early age during the attack on Luke's Academy. He's basically brainwashed in the Knights of Ren; either he knows of his lineage or he doesn't, either option allows for some narrative twists.

There's quote a few holes that can be poked through all this, but I thought it was worth speculating on.

 

I for one am glad we aren't recycling the Sith angle in this movie. I've always been of the opinion that the Sith are effectively extinct after ROTJ and that Kylo and Snoke are part of a new group of dark force users. This Knights of Ren group sounds very fresh and intriguing.

 

It's a plot point of the original six movies, too. The Sith are extinct. Without some vast explanation, I don't know how we'd ever see them in the new movies.

 

I was referring to all the speculation about old Sith like Plageuis, Bain, and Reven somehow being in TFA. All ideas i never liked. Glad to see they didn't go in that direction. The Knights of Ren sound way more interesting.

 

I am still a little confused (reall?)
I know what is generally thought to be but can't remember if it is stated as fact but
So what have we seen that is proof of smoke with 1st order? What have we seen that is proof of kylo with first order? Just asking and I can be wrong but
Knights of ten came out of left field and has thrown a new group in
So I think Knights are linked to Luke for some reason
I think kylo has his own batch or fraction of followers former empire and first order is another group.
Kylo's was with Luke then left to form the cult of his grandfather and some of the empire followers want that glory day back and they don't believe in the first orders actions
I think that some how we will see kylo and plasma at odds
Kylo is conflicted emotional we have"never seen a character like him" inverse
He is "good" or started as good and think he is doing good by trying to re establish order in a way the republic/resistance can't he fails and sees the errors of his ways obnly too late.
After endor everything we have sen mentions different fractions of old empire tring to regain power. That is what I feel this movie includes they are all bad guys fighting to be the one to fight the republic
The resistance is a small group of good guys that are infiltrating and causing trouble for the different groups
And maybe someone's mother has a vested interest in being with resistance instead of republic cause she wants he son back
On the empire side you have first order that follows the navy moff with no sith or Jedi
I mean look thier second in command betrayed them in a way and almost destroyed them.
Maybe they don't want that elements around.