Regarding Rey's rock moving skills...

And for some reason some people have trouble accepting that.

 

Love can move mountains.

 

Rey was trained. She trained herself unknowingly by being on her own on Jakku with no one to help her. She used a staff instead of a laser sword for defense. She had no choice but to learn self defense survival. All this training existed in her before she met Luke. Something like that...

 

Snoke answers that question in the last Jedi, when Kylo Ren bring Rey to him, he tells them both he link their minds together, and that he said to Kylo Ren that when the dark side rises so will he other part light side meet it that is him in the same powers as him. This explained why Rey is so powerful. Luke confirms this the scene where he tells Rey that he never seen this power before except with Ben and it did not scare him then but do now.

 

A very interesting take on Rey and her relationship with Luke in TLJ. I'm not sure if I agree with it, but it's a fun read nontheless.

 

He's right. The ST has been a meta-narrative from the beginning.

Ever wanted to be a stormtrooper but not be evil or a terrible shot? Finn.

You want Luke Skywalker to train you, but ultimately your own life is yours? Rey.

Ever wanted to be Maverick from Top Gun except in an X-wing? Poe.

You'll never get another Darth Vader....which is the entire point of Kylo Ren's character. To compare the two is to miss out on the entire point of the character. He won't ever be Vader.


And TLJ does an interesting thing with all of that. It takes those awesome meta-fan-stories and asks: "What really is a hero?" Is it doing all of that? Or is it just making the right choices? Luke isn't made a hero by midichlorians. He's made a hero because despite all of that, he throws down his lightsaber. Even Luke struggles with that "vanity" and the burden of being a "legend". TLJ isn't an easy 'hero's journey' narrative to follow because we've inserted our own logic everywhere and complained about it, rather than trying to understand what the film was trying to say to us. It's saying: "great story, kid....but what when it doesn't work out?"

 

Except your question wasn't about what she learned, but what the teachings were. I answered you that. What she learned from it is yet to be portrayed.

That's arguable. Palpatine started to actively take action mostly after the events of AotC. I doubt he had major influence to how the Jedi Order worked
prior to that. The jedi being tricked wasn't about changing them to be warriors, or their training methods, but them not being able to realise the evil behind everything.

Both Obi-wan in TPM (long before Palpatine actively did anything) and Anakin in AotC (who was proclaimed very dangerous before his training) seemed to be rather prepared to war than anything else. Obi-wan not being able to properly react to his master's death is something that many say contributed to Anakin's poor (mental) training, which imo could've been prevented if he got the same lessons as Rey did...

 

A fun read? It's two sentences. It's sad of today's society views two short sentences on Twitter as "a fun read".

Besides Anakin got rejected by the Jed Council at first too, and Yoda initially didn't want to train Luke either.

TLJ did nothing new in this part.

 

It wasnt really a question. It was a statement. There was no training.

He was shown in TPA actively playing the two sides against each other. He would appear to the Naboo as Senator Palpatine, he was Darth Sidious when speaking to the Trade Federation.

I never said he had knowledge of how they trained.

They are called Jedi Knights. They are trained in combat. The same way someone trained in martial arts is capable of combat but they not use there skills for example rob someone.

They continually say they are the guardians of peace and justice in the republic. Sidious played onside against the other because he knew the Jedi would get involved to protect the peace on the side of the republic.

I dont understand what this means. Anakin is the only person up into this point that is not trained as a Jedi since infancy. No Jedi has experience in this situation, it sure is not Obi Wan's fault. He is commonly accepted as the perfect model Jedi. Anakin understands what the Philosophy of the Jedi are. He recites it to Padme. Anakin is also the only one that has some attachment to family outside the Jedi.

Ghost Yoda appeared to Luke and hit him on the head for not teaching what he learned. But then says the girl has everything she needs. So know you can learn the Jedi ways from a book and that is fine.

 

No, it was a question. I'm not sure why are you trying to spin this so hard... Here is your post in question right there with a question mark and words in interrogative form in order to get information:

And that is what I gave you the answer for. Training or edification werent part of it.

Which no one denied. Again, you said "The entire Jedi order was tricked into not behaving like Jedi anymore instead to be warriors."
Which was the statement I disagreed with, as Sidious had no influence on how the jedi were teaching their pupils and how they made them ready to solve intergalactic conflicts...

Obi-wan in TPM dosen't seem to be ready for anything outside of lightsaber combat. When Qui-gon died he let his emotions blind his senses, which could've very easily lead him to the dark side. He gave his word to Qui-gon and was ready to train the very dangerous boy despite the will of the Council. He wasn't ready for psychological conflict, faliure or loss. Things Luke made Rey ready for (or at least taught her to be so).

And despite the fact that Anakin wasn't trained from infancy, he was trained from a very young age. All of his post-Tatooine expereinces derived from jedi-realted material. He wasn't corrupted at that point or anything. His personality was perfectly formable. Yet during the very first scenes of AotC it's more than apparent that he isn't ready for anything else outside of lightsaber combat either. Anakin recites the Code of the Jedi, but dosen't seem to follow any of it. He's not ready how to handle desire, anger, hatred, loss, death, suffering or faliure. Things mostly associated with the dark side. Things that Obi-wan didn't teach him.

It also didn't help that when he actively asked for help from Yoda on how to handle the presumptive death of a loved one, Yoda advised him to just let go of his feelings and not even to mourne the loss of a loved one (!). Which was probably the stupidest thing he could've said. "You have problems dude? How about stop having them..."
Yoda didn't even need to use the force, just by looking at the poor guy he should've been able to tell he's ready blow up at any minute.
Which makes me wonder if there was even a single jedi in the PT that wasn't completly and utterly clueless.

Not really. He scolded him for constantly looking at the past and not the present (which was also the main theme of the movie).
And imo Yoda's words about Rey already possessing everything she needs to become a jedi wasn't about reading the books, but rather about having the right heart and spirit.

 

Rey moving the rocks so easily is just one more example of sequel-its in the ST. Too many things are BIGGER and MORE POWERFUL for the sake of it...Starkiller Base > Death Star, AT-M6 > AT-AT, a turbocharger on an X-wing so it’s faster, Snokes ship > Emperors...MORE force powers!!!! They come across as lazy crutches to build up more thrills when the reality is the thrills come from great stories and character development. Rogue One was not a perfect movie but what I think makes it a better film than TLJ (in particular) is that it avoided a lot of these BIGGER is better tropes. The stakes were high and it didn’t need or rely on a lazy writing crutch (or as much) on needing to make it all BIGGER just for the sake of being BIGGER. Luke moved a few rocks...Rey moves a mountains worth!!!! It’s kind of silly to me.

 

This may help:

Rogue One wouldn't be "bigger" because it happens at the same time.

The ST is 30 years later so of course things are bigger and better.
It would be a bigger issue if things were atavistic...

 

True but if the weapons grow by orders of magnitude every 30 years within a few hundred years they will take the energy output of the galaxy to power. Given the length of the republic, this must be a much faster rate of growth than before.

 

In a movie about space wizards and laser swords.....accurate growth time is important?



Civilizations don't expand at a constant rate.
Life was more or less incredibly similar on earth for hundreds of years.

The difference in life between now and 100 years ago is more different than life between any other 100 year stretch in history.

 

While I appreciate the thought, it doesn’t help. It’s still a lazy sequel trope.

 

Yeah at no point in time in modern history would they just make bigger better versions of things.
So lazy.

 

Oh no, this debate still rages on?

It's just rocks.

 

A movie about space wizards and laser swords needs a solid story to keep adults invested. Bigger and better does not cut it. To some, there is no "of course" about a spacefaring civilisation that has existed for millennia having huge jumps in tech in a generation. It feels a little cheap - like they rely on everything being the same things you liked before but on steroids. Each to their own, though.

 

You know technology in the GFFA has been almost the same for thousands of years right?

 

There didn't seem to be a whole lot of difference technologically between the PT and the OT other than the Death Star. Sure, the OT had the bigger Star Destroyers, but computers within the ships seemed much more sophisticated in the PT. I always got the sense that in the SW universe, technology has more or less reached hits limit. I guess the one pro to your argument would be the only thing they can do IS make things bigger to put on more placements for more guns. But overall in 50-60 years of SW time between the TPM and TLJ, the tech hasn't improved, they just find new ways to use the same basic tech formula.