THREAD FOR THOSE WHO HATED THE MOVIE

My initial thought ran something like... "Who puts dirt from an alien planet in their mouth? Why would they?"

Salt is a crystal, it doesn't look particularly appetizing in its natural form. I've never seen anyone take a stone or gem from any other world and taste it. For all this guy knew, it could have been quartz, or worse, poisonous.

I've seen people kissing the ground after getting off a plane or boat, so since their flight down was pretty dangerous, I could have seen a soldier kiss the ground and then spit it out and say it was salty (or something along those lines). I remember tasting ocean water this way the first time I had been to one.

As I initially said, I didn't give it much thought. Honestly, it's a small issue that could be easily fixed in a book or in an episode or what not. Maybe it was rumored that Crait had salt on it. Maybe it's a tradition of resistance soldiers to taste the dirt of every new alien planet, or maybe someone just mentioned it on their way down and he couldn't believe it and had to put it to the test. These reasons are mostly why I don't have an issue with the scene, because it's minor, has little to nothing to do with the story and a line could explain away the soldiers dirt tasting.

 

They made the force way too big with this force projection crap. They turned it into a horrible combo of Dragonball-Z and Star Trek.. it just isn't Star Wars anymore.

HORRIBLE dialogue in this movie.. it makes Attack of the Clones' dialogue look like Shakespeare

 

I said salt because I answered quickly and that came to my mind as one of the scenes that were badly executed ( we dodged Rose beating Hux The Gimp of Star Wars ), I could have talked about Yoda acting crazy like when he was testing Luke, the creepy flashbacks with Luke looking like Charles Manson, that incredible line : Yes, I've changed my hairs ( ... ), Kylo Ren having a pep talk to "Let the past die ... " and becoming crazy seeing the Falcon and Luke 1 hour later, Luke fighting with the saber Kylo destroyed minutes ago, Rey poping in the Falcon and one shooting everything around.

The list is so long ...

I left the theater very confused.

 

I truly didn't see the point of that "salt" part, other than to rub salt in the wound.. and then you see Gareth Edwards with his cheesy head turn. It just made the whole thing seem like a joke.

The crazy Yoda thing was dumb. He changed iconic characters' pre-established behaviour to push his dumb illogical plot forward.. in every damn scene. Luke looked like crazy nutjob in both of the flashback scenes.. what was with Luke's black hair which magically appeared during middle age? He looked like a second rate magician or something.

Was Rian smoking Cloud City Haze while writing this? Dagobah Dank?

"Oh, you see he has black hair! That means he's dark! Literally! Hahahahahahaha! Damn isn't that clever! GOTCHA! Hahahahahaha high five! I was going to write something logical but I Zeroe'd it! Hahahahahahaha!"

Ruin truly is the worst writer-director to ever touch this saga, and his damage didn't end with this movie.. he literally killed off the only two interesting characters. Luke and Snoke. The two king pieces on the chess board.. the two things J.J. could have used to make episode 9 good.

But no.. Rian had to throw the toys out of his pram. He HAD to be remembered in some way after his utterly forgettable main plot.. which belonged in Star Trek. He inserted Luke and Snoke's deaths to do that. If they weren't killed off.. practically nothing would have happened in this movie.

"You better watch your ass!"

"Ugh... salt."

"Let's go! Chrome dome!"

 

I left the theater the first time and I was uneasy. I watched it two more times and that uneasiness never left. I felt like it must be good, I mean, every review said so. But I noticed the kids I teach (15-16 year olds) didn't like it (about 20% said it was ok, no one said it was great and the other 80% were negative about it). When I finally took off my fan boy glasses I found a lot that I didn't like about the film. The Holdo maneuver, the treatment of Luke.

What I did like was the cinematography. It is a beautiful film. No doubt about it. I think he got good performances out of the actors, something which, sadly, Lucas never really did in the PT.

And I agree, it seems like RJ wanted to tell his own story, which is fine. The only problem is, this isn't, at the end of the day, his story. It's part two in a three part story arc, so he really should have gone with it. Instead he went on his own, essentially taking JJ's story treatment for VIII and throwing it out as Luke did with the light saber.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 30, 2018 ---

It's funny but TLJ and Rian have made me reassess the Prequel Trilogy. The PT is way better now than I thought it was. Thank you Rian!

 

TLJ really opened my eyes about the ST and PT in terms of storytelling. While I have my problems with the PT in terms of execution, cgi and acting, the story has a consistent narrative/arc that actually jives nicely with the OT to tell a complete story about Anakin’s arc. The PT really fleshes out the OT with its worldbuilding as you are seeing the political story take hold that leads into Episode 4.

The ST story is a complete mess with no consistent narrative, no story arc, no character arcs and it feels more like an epilogue to the OT because it is retreading so many plot points. To be frank, I don’t know what the point of this Trilogy is from a storytelling POV that it should be called 7,8,9. I understand from a financial POV why they’re called 7,8,9, but there is no big picture story arc in the ST, and that is why it’s such a letdown.

 

I have to agree. The story of the PT is better than the ST, but personally I prefer characters over stories. In this regard the ST is much better than the PT. Furthermore I think the point of the ST is to end the Skywalkers and to become a family without biological ties.

 

My SW journey so farJ: A Haters Tale. (lol, take in jest please haha)

I've always loved SW.

The OT was akin to that first crush. Puppy love some call it.

Everything innocent and perfect. I expected nothing and she filled my eyes and heart with so much love I could burst.

We got older and my love developed layers as I learned more about her. Every time I looked into her eyes, I learned something new, not just about her, but also about myself. The beauty was still there, but the depth of her soul made her more beautiful. I could spend hours doing nothing more then gaze into her eyes. It was bliss.

Then came the PT. The teenage years.

The beauty was still there, but for the first time I saw the humanity. She was knocked from the pedestal I had imagined her on from my childhood, and I saw her for the first time as merely human. We argued and I felt betrayed and lied to at times. I resented her for not being perfect, and with that realization, shook myself for my intolerance and un attainable expectations. In her imperfection, I learned to value the memory I had of her at her finest, but even that was tainted. Eventually I got over my expectation of what she should be, of what I thought she was, and loved her for what she is.

Then came TFA.

That old feeling came back in a rush. I knew the imperfection from the PT was still there, but somehow I'd grown to a point where it no longer mattered. The issues we had were glossed over. We felt comfort in our company. We laughed and thoroughly enjoyed every moment we spent together. It seemed I knew everything I needed to know about her. In that, I felt a small loss, as the mystery was gone, but the love remained. It was galvanized over decades. If I wasn't committed and married to her before, I was now. I figured we have more issues along the way, but if we'd gotten through those PT years intact, we can take on anything.

Hold my beer.

TLJ: Prelude to divorce and the 7 year itch? Or mid life crisis and hopefully I see the beauty once again?

Head over heels for her, I went to see her, guitar in hand to sing below her porch, a serenade of our journey. I settled in and cleared my throat. Tossed some pebbles to her window. I heard her stir and emerge, then I sung this song I wrote for her.

I was met with laughter. My face reddened and she saw my hesitation and threw the pebbles back in my face. She ridiculed me, it was a side I'd never seen of her before. I was at first speechless. Has all this time I'd invested in her come to this? Tears rolled down my cheeks, and quickly, may sorrow turned to anger. Feeling absolutely foolish, I took my guitar and slung it over my back. I looked again on the song I'd written, and crumbled it in my hand. It fell from my fingers onto her lawn. I looked up, one last time, and her beauty in the starlight was breath taking and my breath returned as the beauty was lost in her scowl. My heart was split in two.

Deliberately, I raised my foot, and stomped on that song. I turned my back and without a backward glance, I walked away. I felt foolish. The person I had loved for so many years was someone entirely different. What had changed her? Had I changed? So many questions. I talked to friends about her and some sympathized and cried along with me, feeling my pain. Others laughed at me and sided with her. Lines were drawn in the sand, friendships lost, others gained. However, of all the friends I've made, none fulfills me like she did. I long to hold her in my arms again.

But I'm afraid. Afraid of the rejection I've felt, afraid of the friends I've lost. Afraid what I loved ever really even existed or if it was simply a construct of my imagination. Would she even take me back? Do I have to change, can I even? I'm so filled with doubt, and my heart is so very tender form the wound it has suffered. I'm embarrassed to have given up my heart so utterly, so foolishly. I'm torn between sorry and anger, but deep down, I still love her. At least I want to.

In the last while, I've spoken to friends who have softened their stance her or on me. My courage grows, but slowly, like grains of sand slipping through fingers. Will I trust her again? Trust is earned, and once lost, it takes double the effort to regain... but it isn't impossible.

My hate has gone, and I console myself with her memory. I choose to remember the good times. I'll always have that, but still, it's now bittersweet.

***
Haha, yup. That's about as close as I can explain this SW journey, the closest comparison I can give to someone who loves TLJ and can't understand my dislike.

 

what isn't funny.. is how many of you here are patting yourselves on the back for using offensive nicknames.

hope it makes you all feel better.

Mr Johnson is a human being with a family and friends.

loads of likes and a 'wise' for that post.. i'm ashamed to be a member here some days.

 

It's just something you have to deal with while being in the fandom. It's been like this for years.

 

I guess you're fine with Rian Johnson calling the fans 'Manbabies?'

http://boundingintocomics.com/2018/...-johnson-begins-blaming-fans-for-a-bad-movie/

Or Rian Johnson holding up a sign 'Your Snoke Theory Sucks!' Or the countless times he has taken shots at the fans since the movie came out.

Let me ask you, how come nobody has insulted Ron Howard when that movie bombed at the box office? How come nobody has harassed Alden Ehrenreich on social media? Maybe because they haven't sniped at the fans as Ron Howard actually thanked the fans after the first weekend disappointment of Solo.

I agree with you that fans shouldn't take personal shots at anyone on social media, but it's a two way street as many at Lucasfilms have done the same with the fans.

 

Oh for- that "Your Snoke theory" was a joke.

 

I actually thought it was funny, but I wouldn't have done that knowing the movie is all about subverting those theories. It makes it looks like he intentionally did it to mess with the fans, and that is why some took it the wrong way. It is like when Lucas wore a 'Han Shoots First' t-shirt during Indy 4 production, while in the process saying that the OOT will never be released in a proper home video format.

 

No it isn't. Those theories were just wrong.

 

Dude, I've been through this a million times since December, as I'm not going to re-litigate this issue. We can agree to disagree.

 

I see it much the same way people refer to a politician that they don't like (most any politician is referred in a derogatory way by someone of the opposing affiliation). I think there's a line, and I have no issue where anyone places that line, in spirit. Personally, I find it childish (I don't recall ever using these trems myself, I could be wrong, those early posts were heated at times ), but at the same time if it isn't vulgar, or if it doesn't promote abuse toward that person, and mostly, if it isn't directed directly toward the individual, I don't much care. And this goes for whether or not I like or dislike this individual. I think that last part is key.

If you're (now necessarily you Max, but anyone) okay with any single individual being called a derrogatory name, but you get riled when someone you like is called a derragory name, I call hypocrite.

All that being said, I guess there is a way you could have a point, but it isn't necessarily within your power to control. This site could make policy to ban any derogatory comments toward anyone. Some would argue that they dislike being limited in the way they can express themselves. That would be weighed against the distress it causes others who take offense to it. This being a SW site, I can see the logic of a policy being implemented that forbids people from any derogatory term towards anyone SW. That could also include characters... such as Jar Jar. I tend to lean toward freedom and liberty over law and order, so in a way, that's kind of the issue here imo.

I'm pretty neutral on the issue. It greatly depends if we should cater to a person's sensibility, and shelter them from anything that can cause them distress. Or, if as a society (SW society) how far we expect people to tolerate freedom of expression. I don't think there is a "right" answer, it is a personal question.

 

In my book calling someone names because they made a film I disliked is not the same as calling someone names for insulting my friend... There is a difference. And not a very subtle one.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 1, 2018, Original Post Date: Oct 1, 2018 ---

I agree, but nobody should ever get used to that kind of behaviour. Well done @Maximus for calling it out.

 

I'm not sure why that is an issue. Isn't that answered in the film? We learn it's just part of his force projection.

For those observant enough to see it's the 'same' lightsaber, then it's there as a clue to let you know that things aren't quite what they seem. Just like the shots focusing on his feet not breaking the salty surface were a clue.

For those who didn't notice that detail, it's just Luke turning up with a lightsaber.

 

I am a geologist. We tend to taste every piece of underground that we can reach

 

He took that idea from an old EU Jedi book. So was it lame back then?

He was talking to a specific person if you read the context of the thing. (There's already a more in depth discussion someone already posted and we'll have to agree to disagree)

98% of the fan theories actually did suck. he used it as a tongue & cheek, not his fault that some fans took it the wrong way. Good example of how emotion loses it translation over text. I didn't feel like I was insulted at all.

I don't know if they took shots on social media (he probably just ignored them) but people gave him a hard time about needing an acting coach (which is very common thing in Hollywood.) and people hated him since day 1, so I don't buy that argument.

Yet, people like me who defended the PT back then were told we wasn't real SW fans back then for liking the PT. I'm sorry there is no way TLJ is way worse than Episode 1 or 2. Sorry you can't justify 10+ years of hate with this one movie while suddenly now accepting the PT is tolerable when you guys wasn't saying that 5 years ago.