THREAD FOR THOSE WHO HATED THE MOVIE

That line massively took me out of the movie on both viewings and has no place in a Star Wars movie. Also the "a what now?" lines set my teeth on edge.

 

Just curious but are you an Athiest? No disrespect, just wondering how different religious views may impact liking this film.

 

I disliked it a lot. I left the theatre with utter shock by how incredibly bad it was.

It made TFA look like a masterpiece.

 

Lines of similar nature have occurred throughout Star Wars though.
The word has origins in religion but has grown out of it to have it's own meaning.

Characters have said "Oh my god" Or referenced "Hell" etc.

Pablo is working on a nifty thread....

 

Also, this is the first movie in the franchise that did not feature the classic "I have a bad feeling about this....".

Oooooooh, it's soooo bold and daring!

 

A robot "said" it.

 

You need to watch the film again because this statement is completely not true.

But this is explained in the film. Luke saw Ben's future and only saw darkness. That is WAY different than him feeling the good in his father. If Luke did not feel the good and conflict in Vader, he would not have turned himself over to him. He would have fought him. Luke also stated that the feeling passed. Luke wasn't a saint. He was not perfect. He was human and older, more jaded. Please remember that is what happens when we age. Our experiences shape our views. Young and optimistic Luke is still there, just buried by years of war and conflict.

Here is the scene of Luke explaining why the Jedi must end and how he lost Ben Solo.
Luke "It was a Jedi Master (obi-wan?) that was responsible for the training and creation of Darth Vader"
Rey "Yes, the most hated man in the galaxy and you saw there was conflict inside him. You believed that he wasn't gone, that he could be turned. "
Luke "And I became a Legend. For many years there was balance. Then I saw Ben, my nephew, with that mighty Skywalker blood. In my hubris I thought I could train him, pass on my strengths. Han was, Han about it. But Leia...trusted me with her son. I took him and a dozen students and began a training temple.
Luke continuing..."By the time I realized I was no match for the darkness rising, it was too late. I went to confront him and he turned on me".

Next scene after Rey and Luke spar (after Kylo tells his version of story)
Rey "Tell me the truth"
Luke "I saw darkness, I sensed it building in him. I've seen it in moments during his training. But then I looked inside and it was beyond anything I ever imagined. Snoke had already turned his heart. He would bring destruction and pain and death and the end of everything I loved because of what he will become and for the briefest moment of killer instinct I thought I could stop it...IT PASSED LIKE A FLEETING SHADOW. And I was left with shame, and with consequence. And the last thing I saw were the eyes of a frightened boy whose Master had failed him."

I don't understand why people think Luke cannot be conflicted or make mistakes. Ultimately, Luke Skywalker the Legend, returns and sparks the hope that will restore the Rebels, the Jedi and destroy the First Order.

 

I surely must have missed that. Or maybe they didn't subtitle this part in my country.

 

Incredibly well said.

 

It was BB8 so all of us missed it.

 

I think many folks simply didn't catch key themes and dialog that could change your perception of the film. I walked out on my first viewing a wreck. I thought I hated my first SW film (still strongly dislike TPM). Then I let it digest. I watched it again. I read other peoples views. I realized I missed things on the first viewing. I realized that staying "spoiler free" actually made the first viewing difficult because I never had time to rationalize the choice made. We LOVE and HATE this movie because we are so emotionally invested in our own views of this galaxy.

My only advice. Watch it more. Find a script and read it. Read the novel. Soak it all in for a while and THEN decide if you still hate this film.

 

If I didn't have the Cantina to really discuss it, I am not sure how I would have felt immediately after. I had time to read and process with other fans and my initial thoughts we given some validation.

 

Saw it a second time and it helped a tad. Overall I still have my major gripe about one thing in particular and that's still hindering me from fully endorsing, but I'm hoping that each viewing will lessen that more and more.

 

Yeah, that did not sit well with me. You come away with the feeling the Poe was being set up by RJ.. and in examination of the structure I saw "Save Martha" holding up the whole subplot. It appears cobbled together from late 1st season/ early 2nd season Battlestar Galactica.

 

What

Whats your gripe? I may have the same gripe.

 

Oh man, I thought someone had grapes.

 

My gripe is that I just can't accept Rey being a random nobody. I know that probaby sounds silly to some, but I can't help how I feel about that issue haha. Below I am copying and pasting my post from another thread on the reasons why that is so important to me. If she was a Skywalker or Skywalker-Solo then the movie would have been 10/10 for me.

"My main struggle with it is that if she is a nobody, then why create the hype of who her parents are? Why not just make that clear from the beginning in TFA? To create such speculation and anticipation on a big reveal is going to leave some people unhappy, regardless of which way the reveal goes. The reveal in ESB works so well because no one was expecting a reveal. This time we were. I think if it was revealed in the beginning that she had no connection then everyone would be on board and no disappointment... maybe.

For me the episodic films have always been the story for the Skywalker family (specifically the story of the rise, fall & redemption of Anakin/Vader when it was just the PT and ST) and to have our new main protagonist not be connected in that way is just a little odd to me. Granted we don't know what will happen in Ep.9, but as of where we are now, when one looks at the story as a whole I feel like 1-6 is the Skywalker Story and 7-9 is being setup to be the Rey Random story with Skywalkers as supporting characters to her journey. LF and Disney is creating a great and positive message about how anyone can be special (evident in the stable boy using the force when wishing upon the evening star - cue the Jimminy Cricket song) however by doing so and having Rey be a nobody interrupts the Skywalker tale.

I know that some people might be upset with this opinion and I may get some negative points, but please note that it's not my intention to offend anyone and I apologize if I did. Just wanted to be honest with my opinion and I enjoy discussing the different points of view. Despite the concerns I've listed I am optimistic and excited to see what's next for Star Wars!"

 

If I may....
We created the hype. The movie really didn't. It starts with a quip to BB8 about her being top secret too. Then she has to go back to Jakku to wait. Maz tells her it's not about what is behind her but what lies ahead.
They all but say in TFA that it doesn't matter.
We took it and ran. Pablo and even Daisy said it's really only important to Rey.

 

When everyone all of a sudden wants to ignore how TFA got started, It's no wonder TLJ is garbage. Finn's actions which still have yet to be explained created these problems for the FO in the first place, but I guess troopers defect every other day in the Rian Johnson world.

 

That's not true at all. TCW made it very clear that just like in real life there is light and dark in everyone; Luke is someone who always looks for the light in people, he never resorts to killing unless unavoidable. He never once gave Ben a chance, it doesn't match up with his ROTJ portrayal at all. If this occurred in the prequel era he would have been expelled from the Jedi Order, and subsequently imprisoned.

Luke was considering dabbling in the dark side, there's no way round it.