1. Due to the increased amount of spam bots on the forum, we are strengthening our defenses. You may experience a CAPTCHA challenge from time to time.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Notification emails are working properly again. Please check your email spam folder and if you see any emails from the Cantina there, make sure to mark them as "Not Spam". This will help a lot to whitelist the emails and to stop them going to spam.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. IMPORTANT! To be able to create new threads and rate posts, you need to have at least 30 posts in The Cantina.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Before posting a new thread, check the list with similar threads that will appear when you start typing the thread's title.
    Dismiss Notice
Spam Control Cantina Notification Emails Create Threads and Rate Posts Similar Threads

Darth Plagueis In The Sequel Trilogy.

Discussion in 'General Sequel Trilogy Discussion' started by BB-Rey, Sep 15, 2014.

Tags:
?

Would you like it if Darth Plagueis was the villain of the Sequel Trilogy?

  1. Yeah! He is a very interesting character!

    352 vote(s)
    42.6%

  2. No thanks, Plagueis is dead.

    189 vote(s)
    22.9%

  3. Nope! He never actually existed.

    29 vote(s)
    3.5%

  4. Yes, but he is in the movie as a corpse.

    20 vote(s)
    2.4%

  5. He will be mentioned in another "throwaway line" only.

    28 vote(s)
    3.4%

  6. He is Snoke in disguise.

    12 vote(s)
    1.5%

  7. Yes, his death was a ruse.

    92 vote(s)
    11.1%

  8. I don't care either way, brah.

    74 vote(s)
    9.0%

  9. Of course, who else would you choose?

    30 vote(s)
    3.6%
Page 7 of 631
  1. Batman

    Batman Rebelscum

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Posts:
    329
    Likes Received:
    264
    Trophy Points:
    1,817
    Credits:
    937
    Ratings:
    +463 / 30 / -17
    I continously read snippits on this forum of Driver being a villian?

    Is there any official source to this? Or a relatively concrete rumour?
     
    #121 Batman, Oct 21, 2014
    • Funny Funny x 1
  2. TIDMADT

    TIDMADT Jedi Biker

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Posts:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    3,499
    Trophy Points:
    14,237
    Credits:
    6,369
    Ratings:
    +6,763 / 103 / -68
    I sincerely hope they don't use flashbacks... there are so many other literary ways to include past events that don't involve the copout of a flashback... holograms would be preferable to flashbacks

    There was a report once that said that Driver would play a character "in the vein of Vader"

    Nothing ever confirmed the report, and nothing ever explanied what "in the vein of Vader" meant... could be (as I have mentioned) that he has a lot of potential but a tragic flaw that allows him to become a pawn... it could mean he will do something bad but redeem himself... it may mean he has a penchant for wearing black... it doesn't say...

    For the most, the reports of him being bad, how bad and bad in what way are user speculation
     
    #122 TIDMADT, Oct 21, 2014
  3. Batman

    Batman Rebelscum

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2014
    Posts:
    329
    Likes Received:
    264
    Trophy Points:
    1,817
    Credits:
    937
    Ratings:
    +463 / 30 / -17
    Thank you.
     
    #123 Batman, Oct 21, 2014
  4. Ceruleanlord

    Ceruleanlord Rebel General

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    675
    Likes Received:
    859
    Trophy Points:
    4,839
    Credits:
    2,602
    Ratings:
    +1,465 / 7 / -6


    Palpatine says before Anakin pladges himself to his teachings,"To cheat death is a power only one has achieved but if we work together I know we can discover the secret."

    Is it possible that the one that has achieved the power to cheat death was not Plagueis? He could keep others from dying but not himself.
    or was the power to cheat death only to keep others from dying?
     
    #124 Ceruleanlord, Oct 21, 2014
  5. TIDMADT

    TIDMADT Jedi Biker

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Posts:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    3,499
    Trophy Points:
    14,237
    Credits:
    6,369
    Ratings:
    +6,763 / 103 / -68
    Palpatine does say that Plagueis could prevent the death of those he cared for, but sadly not his own...
     
    #125 TIDMADT, Oct 21, 2014
  6. Willybobo

    Willybobo BEES!

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2014
    Posts:
    1,863
    Likes Received:
    4,901
    Trophy Points:
    13,287
    Credits:
    10,171
    Ratings:
    +7,521 / 67 / -55
    Driver is fairly...um, unique looking, to be playing a hero.

    To be blunt, he isn't a traditional leading man, and doesn't possess a mug that could easily inspire courage. Not to say he couldn't.

    Conversely, he's also not scary in the slightest. As a result, most speculation takes 'in the vein of Vader' to mean in a suit, or getup that really amps up the fear factor.
     
    #126 Willybobo, Oct 21, 2014
  7. TIDMADT

    TIDMADT Jedi Biker

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Posts:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    3,499
    Trophy Points:
    14,237
    Credits:
    6,369
    Ratings:
    +6,763 / 103 / -68
    Yeah, he isn't typical... one would say that if he were standing next to someone like Harrison Ford, for example, he would be second fiddle... which may be the point. If Driver were the child of the Hero of the Republic, he might grow up feeling that he was never quite good enough... that he would feel inadequate... the need to distinguish himself... rashness... the perfect soup for which a Sith might stir the pot
     
    #127 TIDMADT, Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 4
  8. Marc Camel

    Marc Camel Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    413
    Likes Received:
    486
    Trophy Points:
    6,112
    Credits:
    1,829
    Ratings:
    +880 / 7 / -4
    who rated this as "dumb"? what an ass! Great post bud!

    do you have link to that deleted scene? I've never seen it...
     
    #128 Marc Camel, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 3
  9. BB-Rey

    BB-Rey Guardian of the Zoetrope

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2014
    Posts:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    18,942
    Trophy Points:
    145,237
    Credits:
    19,405
    Ratings:
    +19,743 / 66 / -6
    #129 BB-Rey, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014
  10. TIDMADT

    TIDMADT Jedi Biker

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Posts:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    3,499
    Trophy Points:
    14,237
    Credits:
    6,369
    Ratings:
    +6,763 / 103 / -68
    Yes... too bad Plagueis is dead...
     
    #130 TIDMADT, Oct 21, 2014
  11. BB-Rey

    BB-Rey Guardian of the Zoetrope

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2014
    Posts:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    18,942
    Trophy Points:
    145,237
    Credits:
    19,405
    Ratings:
    +19,743 / 66 / -6
    Maybe he's not ... and he lead Sidious to believe he was. As it says in the novel ...


    As Plagueis expired, his apprentice experienced a monumental disturbance in the Force, which he interpreted as a shift that anointed him the sole agent of the dark side. But he also experienced a sensation of sadness and loss in the Force. Sidious initially feared that the cause of this unease was a sign that his master's experiments had succeeded after all, that Plagueis' spirit had somehow survived earthly destruction, and would return at any moment to exact vengeance on his treacherous apprentice. However, after learning of Darth Maul's apparent death at the hands of Obi Wan-Kenobi on Naboo, Sidious dismissed his concerns, deciding that this was the true cause of the feeling of loss he experienced.
     
    #131 BB-Rey, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
    • Great Post Great Post x 1
    • Wise Wise x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. Marc Camel

    Marc Camel Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    413
    Likes Received:
    486
    Trophy Points:
    6,112
    Credits:
    1,829
    Ratings:
    +880 / 7 / -4
    Sidious also said to Vader in ROTS: "To cheat death is a power only one has acheived".
     
    #132 Marc Camel, Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  13. TIDMADT

    TIDMADT Jedi Biker

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Posts:
    3,553
    Likes Received:
    3,499
    Trophy Points:
    14,237
    Credits:
    6,369
    Ratings:
    +6,763 / 103 / -68
    To be more exact, the conversation went this way...

    Previously, at the Mon Calamari Water Opera, he had said

    He told Anakin that, more or less, he was taught "everything" prior to his master's death, baiting that he knew the power over life and death... but when push came to shove, he told Anakin that together they could discover it. Sith lie... canon has been written that Plagueis did, in fact, exist, but for all intents and purposes, Palpatine could have been totally lying to Anakin about the entire myth.

    What we do know is that Palpatine waffles, so the subject is open from the standpoint of what we see in the movies... the book, however, kinda goes into it in more detail...
     
    #133 TIDMADT, Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 2
  14. Maximus

    Maximus Reel 2 Dialogue 2

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Posts:
    3,223
    Likes Received:
    72,453
    Trophy Points:
    171,705
    Credits:
    23,799
    Ratings:
    +78,246 / 26 / -13
    indeed.

    those things were said about Plagueis. it's there.. so it's canon. I strongly believe that it was all pure fabrication from palpatine - he was literally saying what Anakin wanted to hear.. here is a way to save padme.

    in saying that.. when i think deeper about it all i start to get all screwed up by the fact that palp's can foresee events - which is the one thing i would remove from star wars if i had the power. the seeing into the future stuff has never sat well with me.. love the whole "sensing disturbances in the force" stuff, but the future stuff.. meh.. does my head in when trying to break this stuff down.

    as i said.. palp said those things and because we didn't see him later on saying "hehe i can't believe he believed all that old twaddle".. it's basically almost all we know about Plagueis. But.. he also said he killed him.. so that's canon too lol. #starwarsdoesmyheadinbutiloveit
     
    #134 Maximus, Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Rob

    Rob Rebel Commander

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2014
    Posts:
    58
    Likes Received:
    60
    Trophy Points:
    2,747
    Credits:
    626
    Ratings:
    +94 / 3 / -0
    Great post! Palpatine lied! I think Palps is a master manipulator and telling Anakin what he wants to hear.

    How can the story of Darth Plaguesis even be a sith myth, especially if Palps is his direct apprentice? A myth implies a widely held, but false belief that has been passed down. Just stating it is a myth tells the recepient of the story telling that your hearing something that is false and has been changed. If Plaguesis was still alive at the time of Maul, then that means Dooku would have been the only one of Palp's so called apprentices who had heard the so called myth of Plaguesis. At his advanced age, does Darth Tyranus have the time or even care about Sith bed time stories? This to me, is proof that Anakin is likely the first person to be told the myth of Darth Plaguesis the wise. What part of the myth is not correct?
     
    #135 Rob, Oct 21, 2014
  16. BB-Rey

    BB-Rey Guardian of the Zoetrope

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2014
    Posts:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    18,942
    Trophy Points:
    145,237
    Credits:
    19,405
    Ratings:
    +19,743 / 66 / -6
    From what I have read and heard the opera scene in general was mostly just lies Palpatine used to convert Anakin. Then later in his office he revealed "To cheat death is the power only one has achieved" when Anakin wasn't thinking clearly and ready to do everything he could to save Padme.

    It wasn't a myth per say but, a converting tool to push Anakin to join him.

    In the ROTS novel is goes into greater detail that Plagueis was indeed Palpatine's master but, in the film it is only explicit and applied he is. Also more explicitly in the book is that it's strongly implied Plagueis is the one who cheated death.

    A lot of things got left out of ROTS. At one point Palpatine was to reveal that he and Plagueis created a boy named Anakin Skywalker. I have to believe that's because, it was more appropriate to use later and George saw the benefits it could be for the sequels and binding each story together. Plus in 2005, George made it very clear that he wasn't going to do anymore Star Wars films. Part of me thinks he avoided it because, of all the questions that would come with it. He wouldn't have been able to think clearly when writing the sequels. Like he said in an interview it was hard for him to think and be creative when things were going wrong and people were blaming him. So he took time away and wrote the stories in private so he didn't feel as pressured as he did with the prequels.

    A bit off topic but, to give you the sense of George during this.

    It wouldn't make much sense not giving Anakin a father if it wasn't to be explained at some point. There's quite a few unanswered questions in the prequels and as George talks about in the commentary of the films a lot of things explicitly stated are to be used later. Examples of this: "The Other" originally Luke's sister that was to reveal herself in the sequels, changed to Leia in the final script. "One to cheat death" .. we don't know crystal clear yet. Even how Anakin was born remains a mystery. Why did Qui-Gone want a sample of his blood to check his midichorlians levels? Maybe he sensed something. I have to believe George didn't throw that scene in the there for no reason. As he also said midichorlians were there from the beginning, he just couldn't find the right place to explain them in the originals.
     
    #136 BB-Rey, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  17. Qui-Riv-Brid

    Qui-Riv-Brid Rebelscum

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Posts:
    115
    Likes Received:
    121
    Trophy Points:
    1,157
    Credits:
    926
    Ratings:
    +275 / 29 / -12
    My own speculation I'll throw in is that Kira is another "creation" of Plaugeis.

    Well it depends if you think that the movie trades like Variety, Hollywood Reporter etc know what they are talking about. I think they do so no reason to believe SD is not a villain.

    I don't know if they would qualify as left out as opposed to background material not relevant to the direct story of III. That's George's way. To only use that which is most necessary to tell the tale and use the rest in the books. It could also be seen as just another lie. Even now with the ROTS novel and Darth Plagueis assuming that background is correct (which is most likely is).

    It's like the DP origin of Maul. The basics were true. A Nightsister did give her son to Sidious only in the final origin we see in Son of Dathomir Maul is a child not a baby and the woman was Talzin.

    As the final film at that time adding more questions that weren't going to be answered didn't make sense.

    What relation the final publication of the novel has to the sequels in terms of Lucas doing the story one wonders. Lucas started work on the ST in the middle of 11 or earlier but obviously the DP novel was using notes from ROTS and the backstory that Lucas had created before that.
     
    #137 Qui-Riv-Brid, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Darth Qaidous

    Darth Qaidous Rebel Official

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Posts:
    338
    Likes Received:
    559
    Trophy Points:
    6,277
    Credits:
    1,517
    Ratings:
    +820 / 39 / -47
    I believe Obi-Wan's feeling was certainly about sensing something nefarious (the Sith) being behind the whole ordeal, if he could not be sure of what it was that he felt. As much as I would love for the 'Darth Plagueis' novel (and him being a Muun character) to be consecrated as "canon", and in my mind I see it as such, at this point TPTB have not declared that at all. That book and the character fit so well within the film saga and do nothing but enhance it IMM.
     
    #138 Darth Qaidous, Oct 21, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  19. BB-Rey

    BB-Rey Guardian of the Zoetrope

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2014
    Posts:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    18,942
    Trophy Points:
    145,237
    Credits:
    19,405
    Ratings:
    +19,743 / 66 / -6
    Couldn't have said it better myself. Spot on. I did see an interesting quote from the author of the ROTS novel and it makes it clear to me that George was heavily apart of the process.

    "Though I did not personally watch him do it, I received from LFL a Word document of Revenge of the Sith with Mr Lucas' edits, which was distinct from the edits I'd already gotten from Sue Rostoni and Howard Roffman and the rest of the LFL crew, and this document was edited in such a detailed fashion that even individual words had been struck off and his preferred replacements inserted, as well as some passages wholly excised and some dialogue replaced with the dialogue from the screenplay. If that's not line-editing, I don't know what is."

    "What's in that book is there because Mr. Lucas wanted it to be there. What's not in that book is not there because Mr. Lucas wanted it gone."

    Matthew Stover

    From what I have seen it was considered and might still be canon. It was considered canon under George. http://www.starwarsreport.com/2012/01/10/book-review-darth-plagueis/ Here's a story to show that. Plus interesting noting that on Wikipedia the book is listed as C-Canon and on James Luceno's new novel Tarkin it states .. Bestselling Star Wars veteran James Luceno gives Grand Moff Tarkin the Star Wars: Darth Plagueis treatment, bringing a legendary character from A New Hope to full, fascinating life.

    Bit odd they'd allow any mention of Plagueis if he was just a myth and wasn't important in some shape of form.
     
    #139 BB-Rey, Oct 21, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 21, 2014
  20. kanan katarn

    kanan katarn Rebel Trooper

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Posts:
    5
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    137
    Credits:
    521
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0
    EU and novelizations aside, why does everyone assume palpatine was plaguies apprentice? maybe it is a sith legend hence why palpatine says together he and anakin can discover the secrets
     
    #140 kanan katarn, Oct 21, 2014
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 7 of 631
Loading...
Similar Threads
  1. SWNN Probe

    Star Wars: The Essential Legends Collection - Third Wave of Books Includes Fan-Favorites Like Kenobi and Darth Plagueis

    SWNN Probe, Aug 10, 2021, in forum: SWNN News Feed
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    726
    Embo and His Pet Anooba
    Aug 10, 2021
  2. Xeven

    Rian Johnson Trillogy will center around DARTH PLAGUEIS

    Xeven, Feb 18, 2019, in forum: General Movie Discussion
    Replies:
    9
    Views:
    1,276
    Lord of the Rens
    Apr 10, 2019
  3. Xeven

    Need a Darth Plagueis, Sidious, Maul, Dooku, Asaj Trilogy

    Xeven, Oct 15, 2018, in forum: General Movie Discussion
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    906
    Xeven
    Oct 15, 2018
  4. MarsPhoenix

    Darth Plagueis is Snoke and then is the broom boy

    MarsPhoenix, Dec 25, 2017, in forum: Star Wars: The Last Jedi
    Replies:
    19
    Views:
    2,844
    Bluemilk
    Jan 10, 2018
  5. Xeven

    Is Darth Plagueis Snoke's Father? - The Evidence For and Against

    Xeven, Jan 20, 2017, in forum: Star Wars: The Last Jedi
    Replies:
    23
    Views:
    3,205
    Darth Malkovich
    Apr 7, 2017

Share This Page