How Palpatine survived and his motives to stay hidden

The Snoke replicas we saw are more akin to the experiments conducted by Victor Frankenstein prior to the creation of his Creature rather than replicas of the 'first' Snoke, which is what a clone would be.

 

My take away was that we were looking at Palpatine's original body that was thrown down the shaft in the DS2. Why would a clone be missing fingers and pupils?

 

Partial regeneration. Cloning isn't a perfect process.

 

That's exactly what we we're presented with in the film.

 

It seemed to have been perfected decades earlier with the creation of thousands (millions?) of clones during the clone war.

 

Star Wars technology isn't linear

 

Has cloning in Star Wars ever been a regeneration. From what I have seen in canon (not EU) was that Cloning was taking DNA and birthing new baby Palpatine and growing it faster then normal. Not take cells and reforming an adult body.

I think if it was a Clone then they would have put him in a fresher body sooner and he really wouldnt need Rey or Ben to be the new host for his spirit.

Heard the following a couple days ago and I like it. Hopefully get it out quickly.

What Palpatine learned to cheat death was how to take over another force users body. It changes the master and apprentice relationship. Palpatine doesnt want an apprentice, he wants to train and protect his new body. Some time in the future he intends to overtake the body. Anakin screwed that up by getting nearly killed by Obi-Wan. This is why Palpatine wants Luke to replace Darth Vader. He wants Lukes young health body to jump into. So in ST and before he is looking for the new replacement. Rey being his grand daughter would be perfect, but Ben is acceptable alternative. When he discovers the Dyad he realizes rather then taking over he could drain life from both of them to regenerate. He then can kill one of them and take the other as his body in waiting.

 

Yeah, you can't just create a mature clone right off the bat.

 

And what if the DNA isn't perfect? What if it's corrupt or flawed in some way...

 

I watched the Red Letter Media review of TROS earlier and their theory is that the Palpertine we see in TROS is the original Palpertine who's remained on the same planet the whole time.

The other Palpertine in the prequel and original trilogies was a clone.

Either way I've got no idea what the actual truth is.

 

So tweaked version of the Palpatine return theory and I think this works better and explains Sith motivation of having a Master and Apprentice. Also explains a little why Darth Plagueis book wasnt made canon. I have been puzzled by this for awhile because it melds in so well with the PT.

Why would a Master train an apprentice who will just kill them.
Well the Master is training the apprentice knowing sometime in the future when the apprentice is ready not only will the apprentice kill the master, but the master will then transfer itself into the apprentice becoming the new most powerful Sith lord of all time.
Anakin broke that cycle and it could be because he was so badly damaged or when he saved Luke who Sidious wanted as his new apprentice. So Anakin still the Chosen one.
So the spirit of Sidious had no place to go, but accolytes find the near lifeless body of Sidious in the wreckage. They take him to Exegol and keep him alive and spirit has something to hang on to until he can find a new host.

As for the Darth Plagueis book no longer being canon it is because Plagueis doesnt transfer into Sidious in the book.

 

^ What you described isn't really a 'theory" since it's exactly what was intended to have happened based on what information we are given within the film itself.

 

Obi-wan appears to Luke on Hoth as well.

I think people are trying to place too many arbitrary rules on something even in universe is a brand new concept with a default state of differing ability with Qui-gon unable to take form while Obi-wan could take a seat and moved vines out of his way, Yoda can call lightning and bop you on the noggin, and Anakin could take form with no training in the art at all being a Sith up to moments before he died.

I lean towards this being something no one fully understands including the force ghosts themselves at this time. It seems like something generations of communing with them and being one would be required to get a real handle on it.

 

the palps on the DS2 was just a clone and the real one was just chilling on exogol the whole time building his fleet and doing his research, then he got old and by the time of TROS he had to be on life support.

Thats (imo) more logical than the stuff that JJ and Terrio came up with, with the Episode 3 line at the beginning.
edit: Well thats wrong, they came up with nothing, they just put palpatine in there because they needed a villain. The EP3 reference wasnt even a explanation.
Seriously it just felt so cheap, almost as cheap as Maz Kanata saying "thats a story for another time" in Episode 7.

Lazy storytelleing at its finest

 

I apologize if this was discussed before, someone pointed out that Palpy said to Rey "paraphrasing" when you kill me I'll become a part of you. So she doesn't kill him. When Palpy takes their life force (Rey & Ben) he regenerates and becomes whole again. At that point, Rey kills Palpy with the help of the ghost Jedi, but Palpy doesn't consume her body or take over her body as he told her before. Did he change his mind? Where did he go? I don't think he is completely gone.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 25, 2019, Original Post Date: Dec 25, 2019 ---

Good, good...

It felt that way even with the marketing, but I like the way it turned out. JJ should have found another villain. So many villains in the Star Wars galaxy. Some Star Trek fans didn't like what he did with their franchise, but I know allot of casual movie goers that enjoyed it. I think allot of the same is happening here.

Well, hopefully the next Star Wars film will be better... I have hope.

I enjoyed this trilogy for what it is... flaws and all.

I loved TPM when people thought it was a complete JOKE. I loved the Qui-Gon-Jinn and the Jedi stuff. I feel the same way about TROS. Loved watching Rey and her Jedi books. Jedi healing was always depicted in the Star Wars comics finally seeing it on screen was wonderful.

 

Wasn't that only the case if someone kills him, from my understanding he killed himself with the lighning. Rey just reflected it.

 

This is exactly the way I see it. He wanted her to strike him down using her anger to fuel her thus letting the dark side take over or he was wanting to submit to the dark side and kill him. What she did was reflect his attack. As you stated his own attack killed him. Also, at that moment she was guided by the light. She had no fear or anger fueling her and she was not submitting to the dark side

 

Well, he survided by cheating death with some abilities people would find unnatural and that's why there is the opera music when we first meet Snoke.

Everybody said hey guys, this is Plagueis while in fact, it was Palps cheat death's toy.

It's canon and a part of the story. I can't say I'm mad about it now.

The interpretation of the rule of 2 in this trilogy is a brilliant one. The apprentice becoming the master and all the master before him.

It makes a lot of sense.

 

The "Rule of Two" was a fallacious lie perpetuated by the Sith Masters as a road to immortality, with each Sith Master choosing an Apprentice strong enough and fit enough to serve as a Vessel and then feeding said Apprentice's ambitions to the point that said Apprentice believed they were powerful enough to overthrow their Master and killed said Master.

 

I believe we will discover more details about the cloning and the story inbetween over the next few seasons of The Mandalorian.

Having had time to think about Palps return in TROS and how the sith basically get more and more powerful as each master apprentice over time has built up, it kinda leaves me feeling like Snoke was meaningless, which he was, just a puppet.