JJ Abrams Says Ep 8 Haters May Be Threatened By Women

So where does he state that if you didn't like TLJ you are sexist and racist?

 

I think that most of us concur that the "too many women" TLJ criticism is stupid. But Abrams reduces the discussion just to that particular issue, about the rest he said:

Asked if fan outcry would at all impact his vision for the upcoming film, Abrams was clear. “Not in the least,” he said, adding, “There’s a lot that I would like to say about it, but I feel like it’s a little early to be having the ‘Episode IX’ conversation …

IMHO it would have sufficed just to say “There’s a lot that I would like to say about it, but...", but this extra "Not in the least" could be taken as the middle finger.

 

IMHO I think JJ is telling us that he will keep going with his vision for the ST and not change it because of what fans are demanding after TLJ. I dont feel like thats a middle finger but rather him telling us fans that he is sticking to his plan.

 

I'm perplexed that you're even asking this question. Perhaps you're thinking about an entirely different article? Well, guess not.

 

I am honestly asking you where he stated that because i don't see it in the article.
He talks about comments made by people about too many females in TLJ but where does he generalise that everybody that had issues with TLJ is a sexist and racist?

 

Because both he and the interviewers are skewing the criticism. There were lots of things that people didn't like in TLJ, and the characters of Holdo and Rose were some of those things. Instead of talking about that they choose to talk about it as a form of "criticism of diversity", which to be fair does exist too. But that's a very small minority of the actual criticism of the movie. Most people just disliked these characters because they were really bad characters, not because they were women. JJ could have easily dodged the question but he chose to go on. The way he then continues the interview by saying how he won't change a thing, and that Star Wars fans has so many strong opinions about everything - proves that he really doesn't care about what fans think or about actual criticism of these films. His only response to any backlash will always be "well because they are racists and afraid of women". He is too afraid to admit the real shortcomings and that's the issue. But by doing this, he can sit comfortably in his chair together with Kathleen and feel like strong moral liberators.

 

Of course press is always clickbait headline driven, but the whole interview shows what the agenda is now. They want to put the blame of fandom split to one single faction, males who cannot stand strong women. It is similar to call valid criticism as a vocal minorty, so in other words not worth mentioning. I just see a pattern.

 

I got the feeling that JJ was reffering to the small part of criticism of diversity and not to everybody that disliked TLJ.
Altough i liked TLJ I see why poeple don't like certain things in it and thats okay, everybody has the right to express their opinion about the movie.
I think JJ will never come out and tell us "I will change this or that in IX because the fans did not like it in TLJ" for the reaons that he wont criticize TLJ in public.

 

He got baited by the interviewer and could have replied like this: "Yes, there are people who have a problem with these new characters simply because they are female, and that's a very sad thing - those people have a sad life. But that's just one way of looking at this, and understandably there were other people who didn't like other things such as the handling of Luke Skywalker and so on. But I think it all comes down to a point of view. Certainly something I discovered early on in the ‘Star Wars’ world is that you’re going to have an incredibly passionate and vocal fanbase, and they’re all going to have a lot of specific opinions."

That's how you answer these sort of questions. But he took the bait because it fitted his agenda, and that's why its hard to take him seriously.

 

I know what you mean and I also think that the question could have been handeled better.
I still think that JJ, RJ and KK know that not all the ctiticizme is just sexist or racist because it clearly isn't and saying so would be stupid.

 

There is a small majority of people that don't like the film because of this, a very small amount of jaded people; but let's be honest and get down to why fans really didn't like the movie. It's not because of the strong women, It's not the death of Snoke or even Leia Poppins; Search your feelings, you know it to be true. One full name: Luke Skywalker. That is why, So stop trying to pretend everything is fine and fans just don't get it.

 

An abridged version, apparently.

JJ Abrams: "Star Wars has strong women in it."

The Internet: "Are you calling me a sexist?!?!"

 

That's wrong. That is actually not how it is.

People are just tired of people like JJ not taking the actual criticisms of the film seriously. Instead, they seem to stick to this same old boring talk about diversity and women and how all criticism of the movie can be related to haters of diversity and women. It certainly shows a lack of self awareness from these people.

 

Of course they know (at least I hope they're not so caught up in their rhetoric to ignore it) and that is the saddest thing. They are using the gender and racial issue to deflect criticism and place the blame on the whole of the portion of the fandom that doesn't like TLJ instead of the much smaller group that has gender and racial issues.

I'd very much like to see them backtrack a little bit and clarify, but I think we all know that's not going to happen. They kept it vague enough so that fans who enjoyed TLJ can say "that's not what they are saying" while many or most of those fans who disliked TLJ feel like the sexist/racist implications is pointed at all of them. Very careful play on words, conveniently a little too careful imo.

 

I could care less what JJ Abrams thinks about sexism. As he sits there in his little bubble and talks down to fans... As he is working for and collecting a paycheck from a company (Disney) that only "tackles" sexism when it's financially expedient to do so....

Marvel has over a dozen movies now... and not one of them has a female lead that is comparable to Rey in Star Wars.

The fact that Disney was willing to stick it's neck out and create a female lead in the Sequel Trilogy, should be more of a compliment to Star Wars fans, as Disney had to believe Star Wars fans would have supported the move, thus making it a fiscally sound move.

The problem is not that Star Wars fans aren't willing to support strong female leads, but, you can't be seen as pushing an agenda for the sake of pushing an agenda, and roll out very bad female characters.

I like strong female characters, I like a strong female character that is the main/major character of the movie... But I don't like female characters that are put on screen where the agenda becomes more important than the story and the character itself.

Give me Ripley, Katniss, give me the women of the movie "9 to 5", Maggie Fitzgerald (Million Dollar Baby), The Girl On The Train, Girl Interrupted... to mention just a few... A wide range of movies (from different genres) that have strong female leads that allow the characters to be characters and not symbols of an agenda (even though there are obviously agendas behind some of them)

Abrams shouldn't preach to us with his "authority' while rolling out these shallow female characters, and than only speak about sexism (which would be such a small percentage of the fandom), and not put everything into context that people just might not like the characters, or at the very least how they were used. While he collects a paycheck from a company that is only "progressive" when it feels they can make money on it...

 

Look, I'm genuinely glad for you that sexism doesn't play a part in your own criticisms of the movies, but it does for many people. So they talk about it.

It's pretty straightforward. And I hate to say it, but by crusading against this, you are actively becoming part of the problem, consciously or not.

 

I can only speak for myself here
I agree that only a small group of the TLJ haters have gender or racial issues and i think that alot of people who disliked it have well comprehensible reasons.
I do however believe that the comments of KK, JJ and RJ are not aimed at the people that have resonable issues with the movie but rather at that small group.
But i have to say that they could make this alot clearer and they should address the valid ctiticizme.
I just think it would bring alot to the debate if one side doen't feel like they are being discredited by Disney.
And in the end I believe that some of it comes down to us fans. Blind hate for the other opinion leads nowhere. We are all Star Wars fans.

 

Well said.

I think a lot of people feel invalidated by these comments, and I do sympathize with that, but I think it's just an issue of communication.

JJ isn't saying "if you hated TLJ, it's because you're a sexist" (regardless what the atrocious title of this thread suggests).

He's basically just saying "sexists probably don't like women in Star Wars".

I don't even really see that as something that's debatable since it's pretty definitive. If it doesn't apply to you, and it hope it doesn't, then great!



If it still strikes a nerve... well, then maybe we have a problem.

 

Thats how i read his comment and you are right if it doesn't apply to you move along.

 

Is it us, or is it Disney who's actively becoming part of the problem? It would be simple for Disney to clarify in a statement (they literally have people who's only job is to handle issues like this) that they sympathize with those fans who dislike TLJ for reasons other than race or gender. The fact that they are not is on them, not us. On the larger scale, the impetus is on them since they are the ones who can reach the masses. All we can do is defend ourselves and those of like mind in small forums where at most we're maybe reaching 100 people at a time.

If Disney, LFL, KK, RJ, JJ and company keep making the same choices they've been making, it will greatly simplify fans choices on whether or not to just skip a movie, or hold off, to outright boycott. All we want is a bone, the fact they are unwilling to give us that is disturbing.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 21, 2018, Original Post Date: Feb 21, 2018 ---

Thanks for meeting us half way. That's all I ask. If you're right and the powers that be at Disney think as you think they do, I hope they make a point to make a distinction between fans who dislike the movie and those who dislike gender and racial people and roles within the movie.