Why the Amount of Vader's Screentime Was a Mistake

Vader's inclusion was logical. If you've read James Luceno's Tarkin, there was a dynamic between these two characters that is somewhat similar to how Tarkin and Krennic play off of one another in Rogue One. It only made sense for Krennic to complain to Vader at his castle -- awesome surprise BTW -- about wanting to regain management of the Death Star project. Vader's scene of all out killing those Rebels at the end of the film would have been satisfying enough, for sure, but there needed to be context to his character other than what we as an audience know transpires at the beginning of Episode IV.

 

I had no problem with the amount of time Vader had in this movie. They used him like I thought they would. No Emperor is no problem for me. While I understand others complaints, the way Vader works in this movie is fine by me.

 

Agreed. I think Vader was used perfectly in this movie. What is sometimes forgotten since the Saga is based on Vader in some way or another is that to the Galaxy at large Vader is a myth, or boogeyman. The Emperor does not send him on every single mission or at any sign of trouble. Vader is only used for the absolutely critical items. That is why his scene at the end of RO is so impactful. You can see the horror on the face of the Rebel who shoots first after Vader ignites his saber. If we see Vader take care of any and everything that may come up, it would simply not be very meaningful.

 

guess that's just not the story i was expecting (nor the one Edwards made, obviously).
i love Vader to distraction, but personally i didn't want/need more of him in this.
he's like a fine liqueur. don't need a trough when a jigger will do. all the better to savor.

 

No. Lords of the Sith was entirely about Vader. The location of kyber crystals was not some huge secret and they can be found on multiple worlds. In fact, in Catalyst Lyra goes on a geological expedition to some planet (name escapes me) to look for kybers. Point being Jedha was not the sole location to find them.

 

The lazy thing would be to just use Vader as the prime bad guy and throw in Palpatine to simply please fans. I was ready to dislike this film, was excited by the previews but still worried. Then I watched the film and, well yeah it's really a good piece of work. The director ought to be very proud of his work.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 18, 2016, Original Post Date: Dec 18, 2016 ---

Why do that in THIS film? That's not what this story is about. It's not about showing us that Vader and Darth Siddious reign supreme (something we kind of already understand). This film is about the group of rebels who stole the plans. Id bet, if Disney continues with these one of stories, we will get a Darth Vader film about what he was doing in between III and IV.

 

You use the words "video game" as if KOTOR wasn't one of the best written pieces of fiction ever to bear the Star Wars name. I agree with your comparison but to me it seems a point of praise rather than criticism. The sardonic droid concept simply works.

As to the broader topic at hand: With truly iconic characters less is almost always more. I found this film genuinly added to Vader's myth or image without detracting from OT material. I don't think thats as easy as it sounds.

 

Well, first, we don't know that it's minutes later, it could be a day, a week, or even several weeks later. Second, at the end of RO there is more of a need for Vader to act quickly and forcefully - the rebels have an escape route. At the beginning of ANH the tantive IV has been captured, they're going nowhere - so Vader obviously feels less need to act with such haste and force - call it good ol fashioned Sith overconfidence. I think it's quite believable that he'd send his underlings to do the dirty work at that stage.

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and say something controversial ---

I wish Lords of the Sith hadn't been written.

I don't mean that literally. People enjoy that novel, and that's never a bad thing. But it so badly mischaracterized Vader that I feel it uprooted the expectations of some Star Wars fans. The number of times I see it referenced is pretty phenomenal, which means it really made an impact... as an ultimate source of disappointment when Vader fails to match that level of activity on screen. And that will always happen, because the Darth Vader in that novel is like a unique character, completely separate from the Vader throughout the rest of canon.

No opinions are wrong and I'm not trying to say that liking that novel is a bad thing. That would be ridiculous of me. But I just had to get that rant about that book off my chest.

 

Ya I got that.
It just sounded light a slight whereas to me the comparison is flattering.
Or conversely: that something isn't reaching the heights of KOTOR doesn't say all that much since so few things have and will.

As to accomplishement in art, I find the only semi-objectifiable meassure is wether something lives up to its own inherent aspirations.
By that criterium, the original Alien is a better film than Prometheus because it delivers on its aspirations where Prometheus arguably doesn't,
despite the former being a schlocky B slasher flick and the later being high concept science fiction.

If you think that that idea holds water one could go further and say that Rogue One is a really satisfying heist/espionage/war flick set in the Star Wars universe.
It's aspirations aren't groundbreaking, but to me it succeeds in living up to its concept.

I'm writing this as someone who was disappointed after first leaving the cinema. I just can't honestly fault the movie for aspiring to something I wasn't fully prepared to embrace other than in hindsight.

 

I would also go with Vader slaughtering rebels. This moment was just too awesome and I don't wanna do without it. I had tears in my eyes during that scene.

 

How do you know we will never see Vader on the big screen again? I'd suggest that, at the story group meeting this January, they are gonna decide to make more "anthology" films and that many of them will be set in between III and IV. The hunger is out there and they will more than likely tap into it.

 

I have to disagree with the original poster. I think his screentime was spot on myself.

Yes I would have loved to have seen more Vader but him remaining menacingly in the background seemed the best choice. It's like TFA, I wanted a lot more Luke but for story reasons can see why the film was mainly focussed on finding him.

(There better be a lot more Luke in Ep8 dammit, ha!)

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 19, 2016, Original Post Date: Dec 19, 2016 ---

Also more Vader would have meant more of James Earl Jones and age has done its nautral thing to his voice over the years (completely understandable)

We would probably be picking more holes in his appearance/lines given how much loved he is to us fans.

I think it was the right call.

 

Well, we need to realize something: the movie is not about the Skywalkers - though, at a certain extent the status quo is partially due to the actions of a young Jedi knight named Anakin - it is a stand-alone movie. It is about the Rebel spies who stole the Death Star plans. So as some posts have mentioned already, with Vader less is more.

Indeed. Please accept a bottle of the finest Alderaanian wine as a compliment for such a great post.

Exactly! For example, I would have liked to see Leia leaving Alderaan for the last time - which would have been poetic for her leaving in the same ship that took her to Alderaan for the first time - but hey, it was not her story to be told.

And now we know why there was an empty chair at the command table with Tarkin, Tagge, Motti, Yularen et al.

I realised that when I was talking to my younger cousins about the movie. They loved Vader and were so excited to see Princess Leia onscreen at the end. Did they complain about the small amount of time of Vader or Leia CGI cameo? Of course not!! Sometimes we diehard fans are too picky.

LOL exactly!!

Same here! I loved that too.