RJ answered the only question that was being asked

I would disagree Snoke: He is the Supreme Leader of the 1st Order. We don't know how he attained the position. We clearly know what he wants. 1- In every way he can present he attempts a grander version of Palpatine; bigger ships, bigger super weapon, more overtly menacing red guards, 2- His action show he wants to destroy the New Republic and rule. 3- He wants Skywalker dead because he wants the Jedi extinguished. 3- In his strange 1 uping of the Emperor he hoped for a new Vader.

Is there more that we could learn yes but is it necessary no.

 

Then why cut when Maz asks this, hiding Han's reply? Why have Kylo grow outraged and ask "what girl?" Why have Luke recoginze her in the novel and have kylo say "It is you!".

Clearly she was set up to be someone.

 

no it doesnt mean every single person needs a back story, Like DJ you can get away with him not having a back story becuase he is a minor charcter.
but when you have a character who has basically shaped the galaxy that the story is taking place in then you need to explain it.

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same point applies, we don't know the world before the prequals so every charcater is new and so not explaining a few back storys doesn't feel out of place,

WIth this trilodgy its different, you can't just go you know all that stuff that happened at the end of Return of the jedi... the Empire been defeated, them Emporer dead, the light side winning..... well this guy has kind of undone all that rebuilt the empire, helped turn Han and Leia's son is a basic carbon copy of the emperor..... ow he's dead now.... you don't need to know who he was move along......

 

Then the problem becomes how it gets decided what expectations have been created. We are our own worst enemies in this regard. We are responsible for the vast majority of these expectations.

 

This looks like that same outlook that paints everyone who hated the movie as being "mad that their headcanon got blown up". I'm sick to death of people willfully ignoring the droves of legitimate points regarding the objectively bad story telling in this film. People can list plot contrivances, off character writing, disregard for tone, bad story telling instincts, and all around bad pacing. Yet "we're mad because luke didn't solo the entire FO.". Snoke is a character introduced as the mysterious leader of the new empire. He was stated to be more powerful than palpatine and super super old. He was introduced in the SEVENTH episodic film. You don't intro a character like that and not explain who he is and where the hell he's been. If this were the very first trilogy, then fine, but we aren't on the grown floor. There are loads of story and lore in place before this trilogy. Where did he come from? Why was he absent during the galactic civil war? Why is he so powerful?etc. etc. etc. None of that was answered because this trilogy is all about lifting ideas from the past while telling us "let the past die". bantha poodoo. Without the past, this trilogy literally could not exist.

 

We are not shown in the movies that the bigger ships and bigger super weapon are caused by a motivation to be a grander than Palpatine. That's just your personal analysis. And "To destroy and rule" is just a cliché villain trait. Wanting Skywalker dead is a motivation, but what for? Is it because Snoke is a Sith? Or the first Jedi? So many possibilities, for sure, but nothing is shown.

Contrast to Dooku, whose motivations are specifically pointed out like I mentioned before (and you first said Dooku wasn't explained).

 

I WAS A GROWN MAN WHEN I SAW THE PREQUELS!

 

I disagree. Many of the questions were very definitely forced on us. This is what JJ does. This is his style. The mystery box. I rather call it clickbait, because he only sets up mysteries for the sake of it, but never really resolves them. It's Lost 2.0.
In fact imo it was done on purpose to keep the fans active and look forward to the next film. TFA ended on a cliffhanger ffs... How were the fans not supposed to be speculating after that?!
But I agree that not getting the stories fans speculated about don't make the movie any bad. But no one should be surprised about the backlash.

 

Well the new SD's are bigger, the SKB is much bigger. I didn't think it needed to be spelled out. But it seem at least to me to be a large reason behind the neo-imperial look. I hate to break it to you cliche's is really the dark side of the archetype coin. SW made its bones retelling a cliche' story in a bold new way.

I don't think he wanted the Sith Lord destroyed. . . he worked for him.

 

No, she was never setup that way. People interpreted it because Kylo says "what girl?". I guess he should have said... "why is this unknown girl helping FN-2187?"

Maz says "Who's the girl?"
Later Maz is talking to Rey after she finds the saber and she says "I've got to go back to Jakku" and Maz replies "Han told me" <----this is the part where Han told Maz Rey's story. How she stowed away on the Falcon but needs to get back to Jakku because shes waiting for her family. It's cut because the audience already knows this info.

EDIT: @Darth Chewie and I must have been typing at the same time. lol.

 

Doesn't Rey say she is waiting "for her family" rather than "her parents"? Also Maz says "you already know the truth, whoever you are waiting for isn't coming back".

I'm against conspiracy theories as much as the next guy, and hated most of the snoke theories btw, but what about Kylos "What girl?"

In the novel, Kylo even says "it is you!" in the middle of their duel and Luke recognizes Rey at the end.

TFA let Rey nobody be possible, but there are too many little things that left Rey somebody open as an answer.

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In the novel, Kylo even says "it is you!" in the middle of their duel and Luke recognizes Rey at the end.

TFA let Rey nobody be possible, but there are too many little things that left Rey somebody open as an answer.

 

Read back a few posts.

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It is you...the one who we felt had an Awakening! I mean he just saw her force pull a lightsaber.

 

Exactly, and the way I've always known it, if something is in the novelization but not in the movie, it should be disregarded.

 

Those "$60 books" don't explain the film, they expand on what's been shown.

Dunno about you, but as a fan, I appreciate the small details.

 

Exactly and nobody is making anyone read them. The folks that write those books deserve their creative contributions to the saga recognized.

 

Dooku does say that he wants to destroy the Sith in AOTC. This is not further explained in the movies, but in TCW and other media it is pretty evident that Dooku's main motivation was never to be a puppet under Sidious forever, nor was it in his interest to have the Sith rule the galaxy. Dooku still views himself as a Jedi, not a Sith - He just didn't like the way the Republic and Jedi Order were being handled.

 

I mean, that's clearly how it turned out. But do you honestly think that if RJ made her Rey somebody there would be droves of fans saying that nothing in TFA set that up and all these scenes were clear and unequivocal indications that she was a nobody?

I think JJ designed the mystery box to support a wide array of answers. If she was a kenobi, people could say "that's why ben speaks to her in the vision". If she was a skywalker they'd say "that's why the lightsaber called to anakin and luke before her, and they avoided saying she was waiting for her parents". If she was a solo they'd say "that's why they cut Han's response to Maz!" If she was a rando that escaped from the academy, they'd go "that's why she has the vision of the temple destruction".

If it were so clear cut, would most fans have been on the same page of her being Rey nobody? It wouldn't have been a reveal at all.

 

Ummm, no. I don't know how you arrived at that conclusion. First off, he's lying to Kenobi. That was pretty obvious. Second, if he wanted to kill Sidious he could have tried already.