THREAD FOR THOSE WHO HATED THE MOVIE

Spoiler: the battered character (often found semi-conscious on the ground after their encounters) isn't the woman.





Battered woman syndrome is a thing but it refers to partners in abusive domestic relationships not soldiers of equal power on opposing sides at war.

Then you'll know there's enough really-existing prejudice around without having to resort to inventing some where none may exist.
That's a big leap from someone writing a different story to what you wanted and a serious claim to throw around without any evidence.

 

The physical ability Rey displayed doesn't dismiss the fact that she still believed in him more than herself. Believed in him more than Finn, who sacrificed his life to save hers. Finn's choice to go back to the FO to save Rey and help the Resistance in the process was the difference between winning and losing. Not Kylo, so for Rey to go all ape#$&% at Luke and believing that Kylo could be the balance doesn't mesh with what happened in TFA.

Star Wars is a space story, but I hope it understands when telling a space story it is important to show that despite the different species or whatever planet another being may come from we believe in a common goal and purpose. Who we are is more important than what we are.

 

Is it really that different? And abusive father that Luke didn’t know for Adam, to whom apart from their family tie had nothing in common with?
who had been physically violent to him, chopping his hand off, leaving him to die?
I just feel that there is some double standard about what is abuse, who is an “abuser” and a “victim” and when we should condemn it. Just because Rey is a woman her actions are not automatically determined by her “romantic” feelings for a man, even if there were any. I know there is a subtle suggestion of an attraction in the setting and acting of these two characters, it has been there since TFA as you pointed out in the photos you posted above, but I think some people are just letting their imagination go wild and see things in the story that ARE NOT there. Rey DID NOT go to the supremacy because she had “the hots” for kylo, or merely to “help him”. It is very clear that she goes to Kylo Ren with the intention of helping the resistance and her friends, not to have a fling...
Rey may not be related to Kylo (we don’t know for sure yet) but it is clear that they share a predicament at a human level: a talent they excel at and a feeling of isolation and rejection. It is a different rendering of the Luke and Vader connection. People may not like it or think it feable, but I definitely cannot understand how this can make anyone sick to their stomach... unless the suggestion of physical attraction is a problem for someone in which case I completely understand.

The point is, if JJ decides Rey and Kylo need to have feelings for each other for this story to work, he could easily pull that one off. He has the groundwork for it, so it wouldn’t come out of nowhere. He could create scenarios in which these romantic feeling are appropriate and not “abusive”, with Rey still maintaining her hero status. It wouldn’t be that difficult. A happy ever after? mmm I don’t know. The galaxy would always need Rey more than she would need Kylo, so I doubt it. Exploring certain feeling later on at a more mature age in a different trilogy? Hey, why not?

 

This sounds like your head cannon. What you feel and what you can prove are two different things. We saw Luke interact with other people from the Rebel alliance. We haven't seen that with Rey, so to make this assumption of friendship is a leap. Especially when Rian made a point of Poe introducing himself to Rey. She has no other friends within the Resistance. I didn't see anybody else go up to Rey after she lifted the boulders. Except for the introduction and speaking to Leia, no one else spoke to her, so I don't see this friend thing you are talking about.

He cannot easily pull it off. No matter what you think most people saw Rey and Finn. It doesn't matter how many articles or videos or other stuff people want to use. Everyone knows Reylo is a reaction to Rey and Finn. You will lose those people forever. Heck you have no idea how many people you already lost, but I can tell Disney lost a lot.

 

Head canon? What does that mean exactly? Does it mean making assumptions about something that hasn’t happened and we wish it had happened or rather withdrawing conclusions about something that has happened and extrapolating from there? It’s a very confusing term, considering that the word “canon”refers to world building rather than storyline... I don’t find these short-hand terms that could mean different things from different people useful.

But answering to your post, yes, there is evidence that Rey is helping the resistance and feels afinty toward it: “are you with the resistance?” She asks finn with a glint in the eye soon after meeting him in TFA. “We have to help BB8” she also tells Finn. “The resistance sent me”, “Maybe this is how WE win” she says to Luke TLJ. There is evidence also that Rey develops feeling for Han Solo “he’s like the father you never had” kylo tells her, and for Finn (big hug to him in both films). Leia very clearly hugs Rey at the end of TFA after the trauma of Hans death and the battle with her son. Rey is not very used to hugs and belonging. Is it “head canon” to speculate that this has meaning for her, that Leia, head of the resistance, chose her to find Luke? And there is alsoBB8, Chewie and R2, also close to Rey in TFA and TLJ, also friends. We don’t discriminate between creatures and robots, remember? There is enough evidence of Rey’s connection, friendship and bond with the resistance. There is no “head canon” here.

 

I simply disagree. A stranger kidnapping and torturing you before killing his father and maiming your friend, is always gonna play different from a wacked out family member doing bad things to you. If I felt the same kinds of emotions that a mass muderer feels, I wouldn't feel any kindship with that person, simply due to the fact that they kill many many innocence. If they want to go the part of reylo, I think many people would be turned off. There were a lot of people who were confused at rey's behavior towards kylo as it is. To go from a torture table to romance is really really strange to me. I just can't get with that one. One of the other key differences between vader and kylo is that vader is mostly shown murdering his own men before being depicted as clearly at odds with his role against his son. Its why his turn at the end of ROTJ didn't feel like an asspull. They really built up to it with just enough subtlety where its believable without beating you over the head. They've depicted kylo ordering the murder of a village, killing his father, and maiming one of the main heroes. To have the main protagonist enter into a romance with him at this point, would give me YA vibes. Thats something I wouldn't like. That said, i wouldn't be surprised if they go that route.

The gifs i shared were just an example of the tension between the characters. As in the tension between an antagonist and a protagonist. I didn't sense any sexual tension in their saber fight. The hand touch scene in TLJ was totally a "love scene" type deal. Even the fact that she stops wearing her hair in the style she'd been wearing it since she was a child, is an indicator of that.

 

No one wants to talk about how in this article, this writer took pride in talking down to a young black fan?

The young black fan had perfect reasons to criticize the way Finn was written. But according to Hulk, a privileged white man, that fan can’t take a joke or be silly. Then he decides to tell the fan what tone deaf really means.

It’s one thing to disagree with someone on the story but to label someone, especially a person of color. as indulgent for asking for characters like Finn and Rose to be written with a little more dignity? That’s ridiculous and it also shows Hulk’s own blindspot.

This article is not about good communication or being civil. He tries to eschew the “I am right, you are wrong” stuff but then he passively reinforces his opinion as facts in the end.

 

They are not going to accept responsibility on this, because they know they are the one's at fault. All you have to do is look at the people who are always accusing others of being racists or sexists. They all look the same. No diversity at all.

 

For me Vader’s redemption and character evolution was completely sub-servant to Luke’s hero’s journey. Kylo’s journey as a character does not depend on any other character. In my view the redemption of Kylo resembles Luke’s journey in the OT rather than Vader’s: a young man faced with choices with a back story and a temperament configuring these choices. Kylo’s character is trying to find his place in the dark side in a way Vader’s character never did.

This is not unimportant. Seeing Kylo struggle with his conflicting feelings, seeing him making the wrong choices again and again, killing people, among them those we love, makes me wonder about the nature of his malesse and about the possibility of mending it. I feel like Rey: if only he could turn... this could certainly end a tortured man’s misery and shift the tide. Good will bring good with it.

I tend to see the romance more in Kylo’s side than in Rey’s. I see a possible scenario in which Kylo repents and saves Rey and the galaxy with her, and Rey never finds out it was him who did all of it... with the appropriate development this could be the worse penance for Kylo to endure. Romance doesn’t have to be always about making out or getting married. It can be tragic too. And this is an opera set in space. Very fitting.

 

Yup!

And for those who think of questioning my stance on that article. I am a person of color. I know a blindspot when I see one.

 

Rey believed in herself - in her interpretation of her Force Vision.

Sure I see the fairy-tale tropes TLJ evokes - a princess of light trying to help break the curse over a dark prince - but Rey is a resistance fighter on a mission and her attempt to co-opt her enemies most formidable weapon (based on empathy and prophetic intel) was a reasonable strategic decision.

 

I feel like she was under used throughout the whole movie. She is mostly there to be a catalyst for Kylo Ren and Luke to give their man baby stories of how they were wronged.

Rey and Ben facetime each other and then Kylo Ren shows up with no shirt on and this is apparently one of the things that makes Rey go to him.

All of Luke’s lessons, if you really want to call them lessons are just reiterations of how bad the Jedi are and how he doesn’t want to train Rey. Then she goes off to leave. But before she does, Luke suddenly tells her not to go to Ben Solo like he cares so much. Why does he care all of the sudden? He’s spent the entire film saying go away now he tells her not to? What is his relationship with Rey? By the end of the film Luke says I will not be the last Jedi then it cuts to Rey. So Luke has appointed her his new successor and to top that, Rey senses Luke’s death. She now mourns him. Why? They never bonded so it comes off as flat.

 

He talks about how he wants to be civil, and then pretty much calls anyone who disliked TLJ the usual assortment of racist/sexist/toxic/privileged/etc.

The young black fan that you mentioned in that article is 100% spot on in his assessment of Finn's character. The writer's response about "and there it is, it comes back to indulgence and the unwillingness to feel silly" is incredibly lame. I have no problem with slapstick comedy in the proper genre, but Star Wars is not the proper genre for characters to behave like clowns.

 

That man is the definition of what's wrong with Star Wars. He acknowledges there was more to Finn that should have been explored, but that would have taken time away from him man crushing on Kylo, and he says for added measure let's call the exploration of Finn wishful thinking. Excuse me? The only wishful thinking were the people involved with TLJ. The moment he said his favorite character was Kylo he lost all credibility. It was obvious people like him and Rian wanted Kylo to have top billing, but people also know when they are watching a paper champion. Kylo didn't beat anyone to claim the title. It was deliberately set up to make him shine.

I don't know how much of a problem there is to continue with white men always being the hero, but every idea seems to come back around to that. This trilogy was supposed to be about Rey, but it isn't.

 

I wouldn't call Kylo the hero. Right now I hear a whole lot of head canon hoping he is, partly for Reylo. At best he was the protagonist of TLJ, much like Thanos was in Infinity War. There's a difference between the two. I hope he doesn't wind up the or a hero. As for gender or race, I have no issue with whoever leads, just have them well written, give them a good protagonist.

 

He actually didn’t do that. He simply tried to articulate his belief that, to a great extent, TLJ irated fans because it took the main characters in directions that were wholly unexpected instead of providing a comforting emotional crutch to the fans. He claims that RJ told the better story by challenging characters and creating conflict that mirror our world and our personal experience rather than offering trite and predictale arcs.

 

He actually doesn’t say that. At all. He is in fact agreeing with the young black man when saying that SW does indeed need Jedi that are not white, as well as more empowered and significant diversity roles. He does, however, warn this young man not to believe his frustration is a valid argument to criticise a character arc that greatly succeeds in displaying personal growth and works within the story of TLJ. That it is no fair to criticise a film for not making us feel the way we want to feel, and that we need to be more dispassionate and give a chance to the story in front of us.

 

I think that's part of the problem with TLJ (just one of several that I have with the film). It appears to me Johnson didn't understand the tone of the trilogy, or what it should be. This is a heroic quest. Yes, there can be moments of silliness to break the tension. But instead of trying to emulate Marvel (it works for Marvel, but not, in my opinion, for Star Wars) they should have been attempting to emulate either the OT or LOTR. Just my opinion.

And I'm so tired of these writers who want everyone ELSE to be civil. They should lead by example.

I was happy to see Bob Iger talking Star Wars and failing to mention the two most toxic people associated with Star Wars: KK and RJ. Personally, if I were Bob, I'd make sure both of them are gone and never have anything to do with Star Wars ever again.

 

I’m also happy he didn’t slander his employees, because that would have been not only in poor form but also difamatory.

Since when is Bob Iger the hero of this story? O-O Interesting.

 

I think you have Rey and Finn fall in love. She finds out she is Luke’s daughter. She continues to try and turn Kylo. Kylo kills Finn. Rey goes to the Darkside and Destroys Kylo. She rules the Galaxy till next Trilogy.