THREAD FOR THOSE WHO HATED THE MOVIE

Or a free ride, when you’ve already paid...?

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 4, 2018, Original Post Date: Feb 4, 2018 ---

Also, not sure who’s seen this, but im posting here. It’s vulgar, cathartic, hilarious and spot on, enjoy!

 

Either this "dishonored wolf" guy needs to work on his satire videos or someone needs to tell him he takes kid's movies waaaaaay too seriously.

I guess I'm just a white dude struggling to understand the logic behind his bigotry...
Should I too be upset about a “purple-haired feminist archetype” [his words] in a movie?
Is the casting of a "fat asian b****” [his words] something I too should feel threatened by?

 

Doesn't the irony come from the fact that everyone who defends the film raves about the challenging narrative/character decisions and incredible and deep writing. This was what was supposed to set it apart from the other films in the franchise, it was the one thing that this film *chose* to do differently, of course the music/cinematography/special-effects are all par for the course. The irony comes in the fact that Rian Johnson's great effort to be different, take a new direction and focus on his personal narrative/character takes fell completely flat with both audiences AND the Oscar committee. Rian Johnson and his die hard fans would have you believe that the story was "perfect" - people on this forum have literally described it as the perfect film. Doesn't the irony come from the fact that it is not being recognised as such (perfect) at the Oscars...

The irony stems from the fact that RJ practically destroyed the entire franchise in order to do something different and from his POV improve upon the Star Wars model, yet it is still only receiving the same level of recognition as the very worst films in the series. That's comedy! That's drama! That's irony! He alienated a huge portion of the fan-base for nothing!

 

I’m making the call - this is no longer the ‘TLJ Sucks’ thread, but the official ‘What Is Irony?’ thread

The crux of the issue, independent of personal stake, is expectations. Did anyone, familiar with the history and trends of the Oscars, truly expect TLJ to get any noms in the marquee categories? Well, they really shouldn’t have if they did. With very rare exception, the Academy doesn’t generally reward the Sci-Fi/Fantasy/Horror genres. It would have been shocking and incredibly noteworthy if that were to have actually happened.

If there was a set pattern where all pervious Star Wars movies had been nominated for or won ‘Best Picture’ and TLJ, this ‘artistic achievement’, then got zero recognition - THAT would be ironic. Otherwise, it falls well within expectations, which would make it ‘appropriate’, the opposite of ‘ironic’. Does that make sense?

 

The irony is that 99.9% of the people in this thread will still go and see the upcoming movies.

 

LOL, it's not irony if your expectation was that they were still going to see the upcoming movies despite hating TLJ

 

Probably the final installment in this great little series parodying TLJ:

 

It’s not really about that because SW movies make their $$$$ with repeat business from diehards like us. The only movies I have ever seen multiple times in theaters are SW movies.

TLJ was the only one I saw once compared to TFA as I saw that 4 times. So TLJ lost me for 3 more viewings.

 

I'll watch the space horse scene again (just to confirm that I wasn't imagining things) and the part where Luke goes fishing. I want to remember that last feeling of hope I had for his character.

Outside that though.. this movie has no value for me.

Adam Driver, what a waste of his talent.. they did nothing interesting with Kylo and actually made him into a boring character by the end? Hux is now the second main villain? Luke and Snoke are dead? Leia won't be back properly ever again?

I just don't know what to say anymore.. clearly they want to do the opposite of what the fans of Lucas' saga wanted. After seeing the Solo trailer, i'm considering retconning everything after Revenge of the Sith.. which sucks because I liked The Force Awakens.

 

It's an interesting point, and I think everyone will sort out their 'own' Saga after Episode 9. I loved TFA, and enjoyed R1, so I was on the Disney bandwagon until TLJ, so I'm willing to give Solo and Episode 9 a shot. I will give TLJ another shot this spring (I still have only seen it once) as I'm anxious to see how I feel about it on repeat viewings. Will it get worse? Will it get better?

 

I'd watch the hyperbole, considering a lot of fans of GL's films really do enjoy TLJ.

 

Nice to know I was right:

http://comicbook.com/starwars/2018/02/03/star-wars-the-last-jedi-kylo-ren-snoke-rian-johnson/

"The Last Jedi delivered audiences countless jaw-dropping moments, with one of the most surprising being the moment Kylo Ren finally confronted Supreme Leader Snoke. While the moment may have shocked fans, writer/director Rian Johnson revealed that Kylo knew exactly what he was doing from the moment the scene began."

And it's my point with all the movie when it comes to characters arcs.
The purpose, the idea, it's great in this case, likeable in others.
But if people don't get it, it's because the story lines are poorly done.

 

But his motivation is as clear as day. Kylo considers Snoke to be his true enemy and that's why he kills him. It's explicitly said in the film. It's not people not getting it, it's this website creatying clickbait content.

 

I've read many many people saying that Kylo kills Snoke to save Rey... and so on.

But, If he entered the room knowing what he was about to do, at least half if not more that the reads of his arc
I've personally came accross are not in line with what the director wanted us to think.

 

I've stayed quiet for more than 2 years with any substantial thoughts regarding anything Star Wars here at The Cantina or Reddit.

I'm breaking my silence now. I want everyone willing to hear me to know this:

THE LAST JEDI (TLJ) FAILED US. It failed you and me, both subjectively and objectively. It didn't reach all of us. Surely, it should have by design and execution. If TLJ was a manuscript, say submitted to peer-review journal for publication, IT WOULD NOT SURVIVE. IT WOULD BE REJECTED.

IT'S PREPOSTEROUS. It INSULTS the fan-base collectively, individual fans, and it insulted Mark Hamill. He was right. You should've listened to our Jedi, really the only Jedi who ever meant anything to fans other than Obi-Wan and Yoda. You should've listened and DONE SOMETHING.

Rian: Here is your great lesson.

In the moment(s), the very many moments that you remember filling and occupying and "fulfilling" your role as director, feeling that you were acting in earnest to execute your vision, where you entrenched yourself in the power of your position and, like anyone confident in themselves, simply executed your executive power to actually direct this thing how you wished ... well, in those moments your key actors came to you. Privately. They wanted to discuss your script. We, the public, know that Hamill, Ridley, Driver, Gleeson, Boyega AND FISHER HERSELF, questioned WHY on several occasions. You thought they needed direction for your vision without thinking that your vision was wrong and could and should be changed. Instead, you reassured yourself you were heading in the right direction and, in reinforced salty recalcitrance, stayed your ground and went full-speed forward.

Rian: You were wrong. Fundamentally and absolutely wrong. You may have listened to your actors and may have listened to the money and may have listened to us and MAY have made minor accommodations. You went full-speed forward into cold, abyssal waters of storytelling where anything that was truly creative in what you did will never sustainably resonate with the minority of largely non-vocal fans. Time will not redeem TLJ. It will not tell because there's nothing to tell. It's shallow.

Well, it doesn't matter. You ultimately chose for yourself.

I don't think you understood that the implications of TLJ could last your entire life. They will.

I think you perhaps believed you were in a safe zone, even if you fumbled things a bit.

We're here, Rian, I'm here, to tell you that you did more than fumble this for us and yourself. You totally blasted this up, buddy. Ciarán Hinds's Ceasar said this in HBO's Rome: "It's only hubris if you fail." Well, you failed. Utterly.

So, okay.

There's no way to change it now. Right?

Right. But there's something you can do moving forward. Perhaps it's not much, but it may be enough for us to regrow our respect for you: you need to be keenly sensitive to consequences of your actions. Not only that, but you need to DEMONSTRATE that the rest of your career. Most of all, you need to TRULY be open to collaborating with your key actors and respect and respond to their sense something is wrong. You didn't just fail us. You failed them. And they represent us.

You wasted Benicio. I'm telling you, what you did and did not do will never be forgotten, and not in a good way. You squandered it to pursue a few of your musings. Green milk might resonate on paper but it does not resonate on film. Rian, I don't want to say you lack vision, but I think you might. You've become short-sighted. One-eye to your own vision and excluding that of all others. You have become Polyphemus, the Cyclops.

This was your big shot, dude. Perhaps you'll have more shots, sure. But I'm telling you, Rian, if you want to reach others and honorably perpetuate the legacy of Lucas, you really do need to change.

If you disagree with me, no big deal. In fact, it's no problem at all. Go about your BUSINESS. Move along.

Goddammit.

 

This^ is exactly how to NOT have an intelligent and beneficial debate. I don't care if you loved, liked, disliked, or hated TLJ.....this is the kind of argument that will discredit your side. Preaching and demanding that people share your extreme, narrow-minded view on the subjective matters of the film.

k.

k.


And many of your points about Rian are just hateful projection and speculation. You've done some serious baseless slandering.

 

I don't think he demanded that people agree with him. And I don't think he's trying to "debate". He's just expressing his disappointment.

 

Saying that anything is "objective" in regards to an opinion is ludicrous.

 

He repeatedly told the reader what the film meant and did to them, based on his own bias.